Women protesting pro-life policies

Missouri has some of the strictest anti-abortion laws in the U.S. Does the right to religious freedom include access to abortion?


The Satanic Temple is filing a lawsuit against the state of Missouri, alleging that the state’s anti-abortion laws violate their religious beliefs.

The conflict began when a Missouri resident and Satanic Temple member (referred to in the lawsuit as “Mary Doe”) went to a Planned Parenthood clinic planning to get an abortion. Instead, she was given an anti-abortion information pamphlet as part of the requirements under the “informed consent” laws on the books in Missouri.

The pamphlet explained that “life begins at conception”, and that fetuses are “able to feel pain” during the abortion process – controversial claims that were laid out as scientific facts. After being given the pamphlet, Mary Doe was made to wait 72-hours before her request for abortion would be granted.

The Satanic Temple claims these requirements go against their religion beliefs, and filed suit on Mary Doe’s behalf.

Taking it to Court

The lawsuit argues that not only do the mandatory abortion pamphlets make dubious scientific claims, but that the entire process required to get an abortion violates fundamental principles of freedom of religion. By endorsing a “religious anti-abortion stance”, the government is clearly favoring one side, the group insists.

Furthermore, they say, by spreading misinformation and forcing Mary Doe to jump through hoops to get an abortion, the state of Missouri violated two core tenets of the Satanic faith: “One’s body is inviolable, subject to one’s own will alone,” and “Beliefs should conform to our best scientific understanding of the world. We should take care never to distort scientific facts to fit our beliefs.”

Satanic Temple logoWhat is the Satanic Temple?

The Satanic Temple was founded in the mid-2000s to counter what the founders identified as a growing Christian influence in the U.S. under the Bush administration. They currently have about 20 chapters across the United States. From the group’s website:

“The mission of The Satanic Temple is to encourage benevolence and empathy among all people, reject tyrannical authority, advocate practical common sense and justice, and be directed by the human conscience to undertake noble pursuits guided by the individual will.”

Quite politically active, the group has “advocated on behalf of children in public school to abolish corporal punishment, applied for equal representation where religious monuments are placed on public property, provided religious exemption and legal protection against laws that unscientifically restrict women’s reproductive autonomy”, among numerous other activities.    

Do They Have a Chance to Win?

Missouri has some of the strictest anti-abortion laws in the country, and the group is dead-set on challenging them. That being said, it looks to be an uphill battle. The Satanic Temple is a relatively small religious organization that lacks the legal resources of larger institutions. Plus, abortion is a hot-button issue in the state, and Missouri will surely fight any attempt to reverse its laws.

That said, only time will tell whether their lawsuit proves successful.

What do you think? Does religious freedom include a woman’s right to access abortion services?

 

144 comments

  1. Miranda Allison Young says:

    I think they are doing the right thing, but it is going to be a very difficult process. They need to get other organizations to join them.I wish them good luck.

    1. Alicia says:

      Because of ignorance about the Satanic Temple, no other (or very few) other organizations will join them. I hope they can win this fight alone. Abortion is a personal decision and should not be dictated by the government.

      1. Rev paul collins says:

        I quite agree

      2. Stefanie Davenport says:

        Yes, well said. Why is it EVERYONE’S business to decide or dictate what someone should or should not be doing with such a private matter?? How does this affect them and their own life? Why don’t we spend more time worrying about our own lives and stop meddling in others especially when it’s about a Very Private issue that Does Not affect them and their lives what so ever!

        1. John Owens says:

          Why don’t “we” worry about whom we are banging, so we don’t need abortions? Has anyone thought of that yet? I’m just talking crazy here.

          1. Julie (@JulieLadijules) says:

            You’re right. A husband should not ever have sex with his wife if she has a medical condition that would endanger her life if she gets pregnant. Especially since birth control of any kind is not 100% effective. Yeah, complete abstinence, even inside a monogamous marriage. Good plan.

          2. John Owens says:

            You know, your sarcasm might seem smart to you, but I had a wife who had ovarian cancer. She only lived about 8 months after being diagnosed. We were in our forties. I was still pretty horny then, but my libido was totally unimportant compared to our knowledge that she had but a short time among the living. Of course I never messed with her or anyone else during that time. We were married for 25 years and only made two children, and we had a very good sex life until her diagnosis with cancer.

            I don’t have stats here, but you are being a bit close-minded. Married women very seldom abort the children of their husbands. They might abort the children of their lover, but seldom their husband. Still, I’m sure you know how to satisfy a man’s sex drive some OTHER way, right? Then, there is that time of the month thing. Before ovulation, those tiny little swimmers have a REAL hard time reaching an egg, so there are roughly 10-12 days a month or more there is NO WAY for a woman to get pregnant short of surgery.

            Still, if people ACTUALLY worried about their own private lives, women would not be having many unwanted pregnancies and men would not be contributing to them. You really cannot reasonably argue against that point, as much as you might like to.

          3. John Smithkey lll, RN, BSN says:

            I fully agree with John Owens’ comment!! There are many forms of contraceptives on the market, including the word “NO”!! If we all act in a responsible manner when sex is concerned, we would not need abortions!

      3. marincountypi@yahoo.com says:

        Thou shalt not kill. No brainer! Obviously the worst criminal law crime. Religion has nothing to do with
        it because it’s a violation of criminal codified law.

        There are reasonable exceptions: 1) potential death or significant medical problems to the mother; 2) Rape or incest. Otherwise, abortion is a crime. At least it should be.

        1. Jay says:

          Actually, it is a Constitutionally protected right that has been upheld by the Supreme Court. It is perfectly legal and I don’t see that changing any time soon.

          1. John Owens says:

            Actually, it is NOT Constitutionally protected. There is an INTERPRETATION by the Supreme Court of the Constitution which is currently allowing it. The Right to Keep and Bear Arms is Constitutionally protected. Abortion and many other things going on today, including Roe v Wade, Brown v Board of Education, gay marriage, etc. are not. The Constitution does not mention any of that stuff. It is up to the Supreme Court, which CURRENTLY interprets things.

        2. Elizabeth A Bailey says:

          Removing a zygote is not killing.

          1. John Owens says:

            I would agree, but a baby that is 4 months into the 9 month gestation period is a lot more than a zygote.

          2. Rodney says:

            But is it a person? Criminal law says murder is killing a person. The argument is not whether it’s alive, mold is alive.

        3. Carl Elfstrom says:

          Regardless of laws people are going to do what they want to do. Those who are against abortion are’nt going to have them, and people who want them will regardless of whether they do it in a clinic or an alley with a clothes hanger. I really don’t think this matter is ever going to be completely settled. There will always be people with opposing opposing opinions. And I’m all for diversity. Different strokes for different folks. Is’nt that what the interfaith community is all about. It might be best to go with the flow up front and laugh at them behind their backs. Just make sure you have all the bases covered or you’ll be paying a high priced attorney to lie for you in court ( may the best liar win ). I’m still a rebel at heart but when Donald Trump was elected I quit wearing my Wiccan pentagram and started wearing a crucifix, although I still say Blessed Be , except for when I’m doing volunteer work at the Baptist church.

    2. Reverend Krystina S. says:

      Why are OTHER people of FAITH (and those who do not hold religious beliefs) NOT banding together with this group? NOT all Christians, or Jews, etc. are “forced-birthers.” WHY is it that we cannot embrace this lawsuit and sign on with it? I have never understood this steamrolling of “Faith” by one small sector of christofascists who–hypocritically– do not support childrens’ nutrition, education, mental health, physical health, dental health, or any other Rights. I have been disgusted with this whole co-opting of the issue. WHY are the “faithful” not speaking out on behalf of the rights of women?

      1. WestCoastConservative says:

        Nicely stated. It is almost amusing that these people call themselves Satanists when they are preaching Christ’s message. Well, realistically the message of anyone that wants a society to survive and prosper. Thank you!

        1. Cat C says:

          We enjoy irony

      2. Jim says:

        I think the unfortunate thing for this group is that they have chosen the name “Satanic Temple.” Based on the statement quoted from their website, they appear to be quite secular. I cannot imagine they are not aware that the name they have chosen refers to Satan, better known as the one that leads humanity astray through lies and deceptions. Perhaps if they had chosen a different name, more pro-choice organizations would have joined them in this fight.

        1. Rodney says:

          It may be unfortunate in your judgement, but not in ours, it is a very deliberate choice. Also, the tenets of TST are important to us, Satan is a powerful symbol of humanism and rebellion, it’s not just a tactical choice or something.

      3. Lyn says:

        Well done and said. I have no opposition to idea of giving a woman in that situation any and all truthful, non-religious information before she commits to an abortion. But pseudo facts should remain in the churches where they originate. I am definitely pro-choice, but no one “loves” abortion. It is a life choice that is difficult. Heart rending. Those who actually walk into a clinic have given it great thought and are there because they feel they know their choice is made. And it has. That also needs to be respected.

  2. angel722 says:

    Though shalt not have unprotected sex while conjuring satan!

    1. Alicia says:

      Please do some research. Satanists do not “conjure Satan”.

    2. Stefanie Davenport says:

      What the hell, lol

    3. Kate says:

      I agree. Make sure your magic wand is properly shrouded. Lol, giggle, snort.

  3. John Owens says:

    I find it much more dubious when an abortionist says the infants feel no pain and the dismembering of them is “very humane”, than to think the developing embryo feels no pain. It goes against common sense and observable behavior in the embryos themselves. I think they just flat out lie on the “science” in order to justify the practice, and modern people have been conditioned to think the “experts” are above lying, fibbing, or agenda-driven biases for profit.

    1. Debra Huddleston says:

      But the question was. . .

      1. JOHN MAHER says:

        DOES ANYBODY REALLY KNOW WHAT TIME it IS ??? DUMP the tRUMP T I M E !!!

        1. Alicia says:

          Obviously, you have an anti-Trump agenda and will use any venue to promote that. This is not the place.

          1. Ron says:

            Why not? trump wants to drop you and the rest of us into an overtly polluted indentured servitude to the multi national corporations the politicians real owners!

          2. John Owens says:

            Ron and Maher are mindless Trump-haters so they can make up anything or say anything and it’s perfectly all right, regardless of history or facts.

          3. Aal says:

            But it was funny! *snicker* too bad it doesn’t rhyme with our PM…

      2. John Owens says:

        DEBRA HUDDLESTON: You might have missed this section of Joseph’s remarks:

        “Taking it to Court

        The lawsuit argues that not only do the mandatory abortion pamphlets make dubious scientific claims,..”

        I was responding to that apparently misleading portion of the Satanist’s claim.

    2. Reverend Krystina S. says:

      Well John, certainly a girl/woman feels pain? Would you rather in the backalley, due to extreme suffering and terrible circumstance? Certainly it is UnChristian to force someone to be born who is unwanted, severely ill, etc… who may have no chance in life except pain AS AN infant, child and adult, except SUFFERING. I know it is so easy to be self-righteous about OTHER PEOPLE. But… We ought not to tell other people what to do with their own bodies, in their own families. AND– are you willing to be responsible for the children from prebirth through their entire lives? How many children have you adopted from the US, who were multiracial–drug addicted–older–siblings–born disabled–??? Then I find your concern over the pain of a foetus to be disengenuous.

      1. John Owens says:

        There is not a disingenuous bone in my body, Krystina. Nothing I have said is more disingenuous than mentioning all the back-alley, unwanted, disabled, all that suffering stuff YOU mentioned. I think there are RARE circumstances when abortion would be the merciful alternative to misery or death of the mother. I have never stated otherwise. I just believe in true honesty, and saying that a baby developing in the womb feels no pain while being dismembered is patently stupid and immeasurable. Why did you mention multiracial along with drug-addicted and born disabled? I have a bi-racial grandson who just turned twelve this weekend. I don’t consider being multi-racial any reason for abortion.

        1. Stefanie Davenport says:

          The nervous system must be fully functioning in order to feel pain! An Embryo does not have a functioning nervous system therefore does Not feel pain! Us that “Scientific” enough for you?

          1. John Owens says:

            Not scientific at ALL. You poke an embryo, it tries to move. Why can’t you see that? who decided it can’t feel pain? Maybe it can’t at three weeks, but it most certainly can BEFORE IT IS BORN!!! NO. NOT SCIENTIFIC ENOUGH. IT IS STUPID, RIDICULOUS!

          2. Joe Smith says:

            What is it with Christians poking minors? Start with the embryo, stick around for the altar boys.

      2. Damon L Gardiner says:

        I think you should pay for your choices men hurt have needs i know its not popular but pay your own way kill your baby pay the bill and bury your dead just like the rest of us

    3. Damon L Gardiner says:

      I agree… I think its the sign of destruction of a culture when we are so selfish to deny we cause pain to the unborn during abortion because of so called personal choice-freedom this is agenda based d science same as religious right.if i cant get insurance to pay for viagra or a penis implant to make it bigger or fair testosterone replacement therapy practices for malees over 40 then women need to pay for there abortion and birth control.your free choices come with individual responsibility and self pay.equality means equal rights not special rights

      1. Dave says:

        Ummmm very well said Damon.

    4. Bill Robinson says:

      You of course are entitled to your opinion but what you think is not supported by scientific facts. In order to refute those facts, you would need to provide scientific evidence that disproves them and, so far, you’ve not done so. As for whether an embryo feels pain, every step you take crushes a microscopically tiny organism. Did you cause it pain? Does it understand the concept of pain?

      1. John Owens says:

        Okay, Mr. Logic, CAN YOU PROVE A NEGATIVE? CAN YOU PROVE THAT AN EMBRYO DOES NOT FEEL PAIN? Is that even possible to prove? Can you prove there is no afterlife? Can you prove there is no God? Can you prove anything to support your position? No. No. No. No. If the embryo reacts to prodding, OBSERVATION (which is not proof, but is all there is) SHOULD inform you the embryo feels the prod. Can the embryo EXPLAIN the sensation? Absolutely not, but neither could you if you were bound and gagged. Would that mean you couldn’t feel it? Some of you are taking SUPPOSITION and using it as FACT. If you TRULY believe what you posit is FACT, then you should not need myth or supposition, falsehood or half-truth to justify it. IT IS YOUR SIDE STATING THINGS AS FACT WHICH, IN FACT, ARE AGENDA-BASED SUPPOSITIONS.

        1. Wendy says:

          No thalamus, no pain. We know where and how pain is processed in the brain. If that part isn’t there, there is no pain. Fetal development happens in stages. Those stages are very well defined, and neurological development has been thoroughly studied because of the many things that can go wrong with it during fetal development. Reflex reactions to prodding are not the same thing as feeling pain.

    5. Daniel Walker says:

      “Common sense” isn’t an authoritative source for medical science. Whether you think it sounds right or not, the research says what it says.

      1. John Owens says:

        Research ALWAYS says what those who FUND the research WANT it to say, Daniel. Still, you cannot accept stupid over observation. If you DO, it means you have been deceived. If I look out the window, and it is raining, I don’t listen to the local TV meteorologist about the weather. That is equal to what you are saying. If you believe something an “expert” says, which conflicts with what your own eyes and experience tell you, you are behaving in an insane manner.

        1. Wendy says:

          Actually, the research comes from the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology and other groups that fund research into neural tube defects and other neurological development problems during fetal development. That’s why so much is know about the details of the central nervous system development. Knowing when and how things can go wrong is the first step to either prevention or intervention to fix the problem. The information doesn’t come from abortion research. But since you’re dead set on not believing science, I don’t expect you to accept any kind of scientific proof.

  4. Miki Dash says:

    An argument for upholding a tenet of the Constitution: separation of church and state.

    1. John Owens says:

      Sorry. Would you please quote that part of the Constitution, just to refresh everyone’s memory?

      1. Reverend Krystina S. says:

        Really, John? We are all adults here.

        1. John Owens says:

          if we are all adults, why can’t we honestly quote that part of the Constitution? I KNOW what it says, and nowhere does it say “separation of church and state.”

      2. WestCoastConservative says:

        The First Amendment reads, “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.” Although open to some interpretation, this prevents congress from imposing any laws that are based on religious precepts. By extension, if it is prohibited to Congress, it is also prohibited to the states. The obvious weak points are that it does not state “pro-religious laws”, it says it shall not impose a state religion. And, while the constitution gives the right to the states to pass laws not in conflict with constitutional law, this could be interpreted as an area where the states do have rights.

        1. John Owens says:

          Thank you. My point was that the Constitution nowhere says, “separation of church and state,” but since most people never read the Constitution, they are brainwashed to think they already know it. Anything like is constitutional, and anything they do not like is unconstitutional. We can believe something, but it says what it says, not what we believe.

          1. Daniel Walker says:

            Brainwashed, or just up on several hundred years worth of constitutional law?

          2. John Owens says:

            Brainwashed, Indoctrinated, Deceived, Poorly educated, Daniel. The Constitution hasn’t been around SEVERAL HUNDRED YEARS, and it doesn’t say “Separation of Church and State” anywhere. BOOM!

        2. Jim says:

          Well, 226 years, to be exact. Not quite “several hundred,” but it wasn’t last week either.

  5. James says:

    Freedom of religion…. Not from religion. Yet, this is right on the same line of the hail-bobp comet cult. I think abortion in certain classes is understandable. I don’t like it but it could be help in a few situations. Just being a whore and aborting a child for convenience? That’s disgusting. Do it but remove the ability to ever have a child again. That way the cost is super high in every way. But people might understand what is the definition of a right! We can’t have things 2 ways. Either the majority wants govt in every reach of health care, or only in the furtherest regulations of insurance. Yet, we all know that the more people in your business the less control over you business you have. So good luck on being really morally bankrupt. That’s my opinion.

    1. Daniel Walker says:

      They’ll call you a whore for having an abortion.

      Or they’ll call you a whore for getting pregnant in the first place.

      Or they’ll call you a whore for even having sex.

      At the end of the day, they’ll call you a whore just for being a woman. And what’s why we no longer take medical advice from strangers shooting their mouths off about who’s “being a whore.”

      1. John Owens says:

        You sound like a whore-hopper.

        1. Kate says:

          John, you are just plain insulting and ignorant to anyone who disagrees with you.

          1. John Owens says:

            Oh, and I suppose you saying that is NOT ignorant and insulting? Bite me, Wench.

  6. Gallet Christ Sampu says:

    In this matter; Our best scientific must acknoledge ; it is written in Qu’ran ”And if those who disbilieve join battle with you they will not find for the law of God anything of power to change. And it is He Who has withheld men’s hands from you, and haswithheld your hands from them, in valley of Mecca,after He had made you victors over them. God is seer of what you do.
    They are the ones who disbelieved and debarred you from the inviolable Place of Worship, and debarred thwe offering from reaching its goal. And if it had not been for believing men and believeing women, whom you know not-lest you should tread them underfoot and thus incur guilt for them unknowingly; that God might bring into His mercy whom He will- If (the believers and the disbelievers) had been clearly separated We veritly had punished those of them who disbilieved with painful punishment.

    So far in the same Chapter it is written again:”It is He Who has sent His Messenger with the guidance and religion of truth,that He may cause it to prevail over all religions. And God suffices as a witness.

    Brothers and sisters I would like to end with this : Say:: Would you teach God your religion, when God knows all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth, and God is Aware of all things?
    They make it favor to you that they have surrendered. Say: Deem not your surrender a favor on you, inasmuch as He has guided you to faith,if you are earnest. Lo! God knows the Unseen of the heavens and the earth. And God is seer of what you do.

    Brothers and sisters let the comforter guide us in the right path!!!
    This is my sharing opinions as guided!!!

  7. Re. Nancy Willingham says:

    The Satanists may be a small group now, but if this case gains national attention, and especially if the Satanists win, won’t the pro-abortion folks flock to become Satanists? It may not be a small group for long. The advice given to women might be, “You can’t get an abortion in Missouri, unless you’re a Satanist. Here is a nice little pamphlet listing when and where they meet…” My personal belief is that a woman has a right to choose what to do with her body up until she puts another person into it. Then there are two people’s rights to consider, three, if you count the father. I know all the arguments about rape and incest victims, deformed babies and so forth. But science cannot tell us when the soul enters the body. Does it enter when there are only two cells joined, the egg and sperm? Can two cells contain a soul? If not, how many cells does the soul require? How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?

    1. Reverend Krystina S. says:

      Actually, in the Bible, a person is only a person AFTER they have drawn their first breath. Then they have a soul, ACCORDING to the BIBLE. So there’s your answer. Just FYI, since people insist on being so “literal” and all. And no, science isn’t about “when the soul enters the body:” lots of people don’t even believe in the soul, so… You know, when Christofascists who own businesses want to deny medical coverage because of their “belief,” that can discount their costs– so guess everyone will join a sect that believes ONLY in Faith Healing, to save their business money????? Yeah, sounds pretty silly. You don’t have to say what your religious belief is to get an abortion. It’s supposed to be OUR RIGHT IN THE UNITED STATES. Because women and girls were suffering terribly, dying, etc. (but only the UNRICH ones who couldn’t get an abortion other ways.) We are supposed to be for EQUALITY. And your rhetorical questions are facile and nonsensical, though well-suited to the Middle Ages.

      1. Reverend Krystina S. says:

        Forgot to mention, but the egg and sperm each only contain HALF the genetic material for life. They are not able to divide on their own… also, what do you do about identical twins? do they share a soul? SMDH.

        1. Re. Nancy Willingham says:

          Be nice, Krystina. Let’s keep our conversation free of angry attacks on each other. You made some good points in your post. However, I am not drawn into further dialogue with someone who responds with insults and name calling.

      2. John Owens says:

        Krystina, your first statement here is a common misconception. If they have to draw breath first, then why did Mary and Elizabeth’s babies “leap” in the womb when the two cousins encountered one another while pregnant, if they were not PEOPLE or AWARE? Many people in scripture were prophesied ahead of time and cared for BEFORE birth–Isaac, Jacob, Samson, Jeremiah, Elijah, John the Baptist, and Christ, among many.

      3. Damon L Gardiner says:

        Then pay for it yourself if your such a big girl put on the big girl panties and pay your way.equal rights does not mean special rights same goes for illegals

        1. Rev. CC says:

          I can speak for myself, as a woman, and ask how can we pay for it ourselves if the procedure itself is illegal or have the procedure contain so many roadblocks around it as to require religious leaning “instruction” via pamphlets or movies or waiting periods?

          Is this argument over abortion and birth control being covered by insurance or is it over the procedure of abortion itself? I don’t recall the article mentioning Mary Doe having issues with payment, only access.

          I cannot judge anyone for wanting an abortion. Is it right for me? Maybe not, but maybe so. I have not had to make this decision.

          But I’m hoping I can have the choice to make a decision for myself without Bibles or other religions telling me what is right or wrong, let alone some male lawmakers that have no idea of my situation, why I have to make this decision, or how I’m going to deal with this decision the rest of my life.

          Mind your own body – let me take care of my own, safely, humanely, and out of the judgement of so-called “religious” people. God and I are A-ok and I ask that He protect me from his followers’ interpretation of His will.

          1. Kate says:

            Well said. I love the last paragraph.

          2. Jim says:

            Well done. You rock, Rev.!

          3. Wendy says:

            The last sentence is maybe the best statement I have ever seen. Thank you for that.

      4. Royal Muser says:

        Psalm 139:13-15
        For you created my inmost being;
        you knit me together in my mother’s womb.
        I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
        your works are wonderful,
        I know that full well.
        My frame was not hidden from you
        when I was made in the secret place,
        when I was woven together in the depths of the earth.

        1. John Owens says:

          PERFECT quotation, Muser.

      5. william lemon says:

        The value of a human being cannot be measured in dollars and cents as some of these offerings might suggest . If a person seeks to make a choice it is their God given right. however when you stand in judgement before God be ready willing and able to give an accounting for the choices you make and hope God is merciful.

  8. Doug Barron says:

    Does the satan see a infant human as a human; or not?

  9. ldcrone says:

    There is a fine line being walked in this article. From a political perspective, there’s not enough information to consider whether they have a case or not. How does it violate their religious freedom? On what grounds? What documented belief is being violated? It’s an easy defense to use if you can make up any religious reason to do something then decry someone violated you. On the other hand, from a religious perspective, if a religious right is in deed being violated under the letter of the law, are we not obligated to protect that right even though the religious itself may be totally against what we believe? In the 1980’s, Rev. Sun Myung Moon had his tax exempt status stripped from his church so the government could then prosecute him for tax evasion. At the time, clergy everywhere cried foul because it set a dangerous precedent he government could use against churches in the future. And, indeed, they have. Sometimes we have to look beyond the issue and look at the bigger picture to get a better idea of what’s really happening.

    1. Richard says:

      Yes, they have a case. Their freedom of religion is the same as yours and mine. You are not allowed to force your religious beliefs on me or into our laws. I am not allowed to force mine on you. If a law, any law, denies me access to services or denies me my freedom of expression, the law is wrong and a suit should be filed.

      Personally, I believe in freedom of choice. Because someone else’s choice is not my business, the choice to have an abortion for any reason must be upheld. Roe v Wade was not a religious judgement. It was a judicial judgement concerning freedom of access to safe medical service. If abortion is illegal, the abortions won’t stop, they will just be unsafe.

      Get a clue. I reiterate, your religious beliefs and your religious freedom do not give you the right to force your beliefs upon me.

      1. If you don’t believe in abortion, then DON’T GET ONE.
      2. If you don’t believe in abortion, you HAVE NO RIGHT to deny someone else of that choice.
      3. The God you believe in is no different than anyone else’s. Why does your God hate abortion and mine doesn’t? Simple answer, religious freedom.

      1. John Owens says:

        If only people on the left would apply this same logic to the right to keep and bear arms. If you don’t believe in private gun ownership, DON’T GET ONE. If you don’t believe in private gun ownership, you HAVE NO RIGHT to deny someone else of that choice. Why does your God hate guns and mine doesn’t? Freedom.

  10. Chad Ali says:

    Abortion is wrong and any one who fights for it has serous issues. I raised my children I didn’t kill them like most of these idiot people who can not handle the responsibility of being a parent. Protect your self or stop having sex. God bless

    1. Rev. CC says:

      Matthew 7:1-3 English Standard Version (ESV)

      Judging Others

      7 “Judge not, that you be not judged. 2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. 3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?”

      Just Sayin’.

      1. Royal Muser says:

        Matthew 7:1-3 must be used in the full context of what Jesus says, it cannot be standalone; you must include verses 4 and 5 also, for these verses tell us that we are not to be a hypocritical judge. If we are a drunkard, we cannot tell someone that their drinking is a sin; not until we beat that demon that has us. If we are living with someone out of wedlock, we cannot scream about the gay couple down the street; not until we marry and remove the demon of sexual debauchery.

        Christians are commanded to judge and rebuke fellow Christians, but not the world; for judgement of the world is left to God.

      2. John Owens says:

        All of us should judge ourselves, but having a few “absolutes” in one’s ideology is not necessarily judging, as in condemnation of another individual. Is it “judging” if a few mental health professionals deem someone incompetent? If you work a math problem on paper or a board and someone else sees an error in the math, is that judging? If you see an error in a person’s logic or a contradiction in their philosophy, is that judging? I’m just asking, for everyone’s consideration.

    2. Richard says:

      Your religious freedom does not allow you the freedom to judge my actions or my choices. Roe v Wade was a judicial decision concerning safe medical procedures. If abortion was illegal, abortions wouldn’t stop, they would just become more unsafe.

      Your children will make decisions in the future that you might not agree with. You will still love them because they are your children. If your daughter decided to have an abortion (for any reason) it will be her decision, NOT YOURS. If abortion was illegal, she might die during the procedure. Could you live with knowing that?

      Get a clue.

  11. Damon L Gardiner says:

    If i cant use power plant medicines legally for religious purposes you cant kill people.equal rights not special rights.

    1. Barry Worthington says:

      Every human being has the right to the health of their own body. No one can say whether a fetus of a few weeks has any sense of self or not. The existence of the intrinsic soul may become an individual anew . Do not presuppose what is the essence of abeing. Does love exist in reality?
      Can you prove you exist? DeCarte stated that “I think, therefore I am”. But was he sure ?
      Thank you for your existance
      G. Barry Worthington, Ph. D. Minister

  12. Mike Hosier says:

    I AM A MINISTER, though my beliefs may differ on this matter, if you dont want children dont have sex, but if you choose to have sex and concive a child dont murder him(her) just because you dont want to be an adult and own your mistake,

    HOWEVER, if you did not choose to have sex, and end up pregnant by means of rape or other unformentioned sexual assault it should be the mothers choice what happens not the choice of the government or the church, of course adoption is still an option.

    finally as a minister i am obligated, and privilaged to say if a child is concived of a true virgin with no sexual, or mans assistance then the child should be considered to important to KILL and should until proven otherwise be considered the massiah.

    1. Elizabeth A Bailey says:

      I remember my father telling me of a virgin being inseminated by sperm leftover in the warm tub of a previous user of the tub. He masturbated, emptied the tub, and she came in and filled it within a few minutes. The sperm survived, swam around in her bath water, and then did what sperm were made to do.

      1. John Owens says:

        Hmm, sounds like a fish story to explain a pregnancy that should not have occurred. If her hymen was intact, how did the sperm swim past it?

    2. Richard says:

      Mr MINISTER,
      Religious freedom is a phrase you obviously do not understand. Your religious freedom gives ypu the right to live YOUR LIFE according to your beliefs. It does NOT give you the right to force me or anyone else to live their lives according to YOUR BELIEFS. My beliefs may be different from yours but I would never expect you to live by MY standards.

      You are ignoring your holy book by forcing your beliefs on others.

      I suggest you re-read Matthew 7, a few times if necessary. Until you understand your own book and live by it’s teaching, you are a hypocrite.

  13. James says:

    What does the King James Bible say about this matter. Thou shalt not kill. This means the unborn child too. Final answer!!!!

    1. Daniel Walker says:

      The King James Bible is not the basis for American law. So who cares what it says in this context?

      1. John Owens says:

        It is as least as valid as any other opinion on this matter, so if it matters to anyone, it is as valid as any other authority.

  14. Pastor B says:

    Exodus 20:13 Thou shall not murder.you know the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another. That describes abortion to many of us. The baby is a human who breathes, feels pain reacts to its mothers voice and other stimuli in utero. .
    Birth control should not be abortion for both the mother’s and the baby’s welfare, Two of my children are the result of marital rape. I was beaten to make me lose one of my children. It was not the children’s fault they were conceived! The alternative would be better services for the woman carrying the child for adoption by one of the many people unable to conceive a child or for them to become the mother. Who knows that we have not already allowed the person who could cure cancer to be aborted?

    1. Richard says:

      Matthew 7: judge not lest ye be judged

      You are ignoring the most important passage in your book.

  15. Pastor Laura says:

    I can’t believe I am siding with Satan worshipers but I am pro-choice and believe the government should stay out of my uterus. I agree that there is no scientific proof of anything that PP is required to put in their pamphlets. I also live in the State of Missouri and agree that our laws are extremely overbearing and overreaching. I will write to my legislators and share my opinion as a resident of the State of Missouri.

    1. John Owens says:

      If people would control who stays out of their uterus and gets into it, nobody would be talking about this anyway.

      1. Linda Yancey says:

        John, if people would use birth control, this wouldn’t be such a big deal. But for some reason you are thought to be a slut if you are prepared. When did this happen? When did making a correct decision make you a bad person? It happened when the religious right decided that they needed to control women’s bodies. If you taught about birth control in school, the abortion rate would drop like a rock, for teens and for older women who dont really know anything about it and are afraid to ask. Use birth control that is what its for.

        1. John Owens says:

          Linda, I didn’t say it makes a woman a slut to be prepared, unless she’s prepared for a different guy every few days, THEN she’s a slut, but then, so are the guys. I don’t believe in any of that double standard stuff. And, why do so many people parrot this phrase, “controlling women’s bodies?” You know that is a talking point, and not an actual thought, don’t you? Like, “women’s reproductive rights?” It’s a talking point, and using it means you are being indoctrinated. If parents set a good example and governed their children, and schools followed parents’ wishes in their teachings, there would be a lot less messing around. People who cannot provide for themselves in life have NO BUSINESS WHATSOEVER having sex. We all know they do, but in decades past, they did it a whole lot less or a whole lot more carefully. I strongly believe in birth control. I just do not accept the slaughter of innocents as a form of birth control.

          1. Bernard Moleman says:

            WOMEN should be monogamous.It is in the bible and GODS will. Liberals media indoctrinates women every day into promiscuity and unholy flesh baring.

          2. JOHN MAHER says:

            JOHN BOOGER OWINS how MANY YEARS did U work on a FISHING TRAWLER BAITING the HOOKS, YOU CERTAINLY POST LIKE a MASTERBATER, PROBOBLY CAUGHT EELs

          3. John Owens says:

            I agree, Bernard, except EVERYONE should be monogamous, male and female. “The body was not created for fornication.”

      2. JOHN MAHER says:

        W T F let YOU OUT of ANY UTERUS, UR from a PLATYPUS NIDO…………………..JOHN BOOGER OWINS

        1. Jim says:

          Holy crap, Dude! What is wrong with you? You hit every blog and say the same stupid stuff. You’re clearly a troll, and you need to back under your bridge and eat a goat. Get a life!

      3. Richard says:

        Matthew 7, read it, learn it and LIVE IT!!!

    2. Daniel Walker says:

      The Satanic Temple are not Satan worshipers.

      1. Garry Lee says:

        Then they should change their name!!

      2. John Owens says:

        That’s what the experts say, I guess. They had to name it something, so they just named it Satanic. Satanic doesn’t mean Satanic. It means something else– Humanist, I suppose. No reason people should name their church anything related to what they worship.

        1. Jim says:

          The Hebrew translation of Satan is “enemy” or “adversary.” Maybe they were going for that? A poor choice, in retrospect.

    3. Richard says:

      BRAVO!!!
      Freedom of religion does not mean freedom to force your religious beliefs on me because that would violate MY religious freedom. My belief in right to choice will not be violated by anyone, especially those who ignore their own holy book’s (Matthew 7) teachings!

  16. Reverend Robin says:

    It is about time someone did this. That it is the Satanic Temple, is irrelevant. ALL people in this country have the right to their own beliefs. What they do NOT have, is the right to impose those beliefs on others. The solution is simple. If your belief prohibits abortion, don’t have one. It is time to stop the religious supremacists.

    1. John Owens says:

      …and if your belief entails human sacrifice, go for it, and don’t let those religious kooks stop you.

      1. Richard says:

        Your talent for sarcastic irony is not lost on me but is lost on the other religiots.

        1. John Owens says:

          Thank you.

  17. Johnny Doeseph says:

    They should do whatever they want, but abortions should be legal anyway.

  18. Debi K Baughman says:

    “The pamphlet explained that “life begins at conception”, and that fetuses are “able to feel pain” during the abortion process – controversial claims that were laid out as scientific facts. After being given the pamphlet, Mary Doe was made to wait 72-hours before her request for abortion would be granted.

    The Satanic Temple claims these requirements go against their religion beliefs, and filed suit on Mary Doe’s behalf.”

    While the scientific view of when life begins may be dubious, it is not necessarily based on a Religious judgment. Various Nations believe different things based on the same information of the life of a fetus, and when it becomes a ‘baby’. Maybe the wording should be changed to include various ideologies on that specific matter, but they can do it easily with-out using any kind of religious or spiritual texts.
    Because it is another (life) being considered, having a person wait is also not going against any religious belief; a young woman seeking a hysterectomy is often turned down due to age. Sometimes they are asked to wait, to re-examine, re-determine and re-confirm for themselves if this is really want they want, after being given full medical information of pro’s and cons.
    I fight hard for the right to choose, and I fight hard for Religious vs Constitutional rights, but I don’t see these steps as being a religious controversy, only practical.

    Read more at https://www.themonastery.org/blog/2017/09/satanic-temple-suing-missouri-over-anti-abortion-laws/#2EF11wIF86hUszcl.99

    1. Richard says:

      In order for a fetus to FEEL anything, it must have brain waves. Fetuses do not develop brain waves until the beginning of the second trimester (fourth month of gestation). Any arguments that fetuses feel pain duringa first trimester abortion are based on false evidence and lies.

      1. John Owens says:

        Well, there you go. After four months, it is cruel.

  19. Don says:

    I believe in totality the word of the Bible. The Bible is quite clear on tbis subject. WE DO NOT KILL CHILDREN.

    1. Daniel Walker says:

      Unless they’re filthy Canaanites, of course.

      1. John Owens says:

        Yes. That was okay. If only they’d killed them all.

      2. Jim says:

        Or perhaps God killing the first born of Egypt. That seemed to slip under the “WE DO NOT KILL CHILDREN” rule.

    2. Richard says:

      But having sex wiyh children is fine, right?

      You cherry-pick ykur precious book and ignore it’s most important passage!

      Matthew 7

  20. Christopher Holloway says:

    Personally, abortion is murder of a unborn child for purposes that could have been avoided, generally speaking. However, that being said, its anti-Christian to believe in abortions and as Christians we should do everything in our power to teach against them.
    This being said, we’re to love everyone and never judge them. By doing this and teaching what God says sin is in a kind way then we can hope for a positive outcome.

    1. Richard says:

      Ok, so don’t have an abortion. Your religious beliefs do not give you the right to force your beliefs on me.

      Roe v Wade will stand.

  21. Bill Fox says:

    I’m not sure Satan is happy about his offspring being murdered.

    1. John Owens says:

      Good one, Bill. Cracked me up.

  22. william lemon says:

    God gave Adam and Eve a choice, even if you think that’s a fairy tale (which I personally don’t), and look where we are now.

    1. Amber Fry says:

      The point is if God gave the choices then perhaps letting God’s Will alone is a better idea… ESPECIALLY if you don’t think it a fairytale.

  23. D. Howe says:

    IF Hobby Lobby can be stated to be a “person” and therefore have rights to discriminate against employees (by virtue of NOT paying for health care THEY deem irreligious) then I don’t see why anyone cannot be considered to have legal religious rights.

  24. Amber Fry says:

    I’d say of course they do have a case. No law should be made supporting one religious ideal over any other. Even the bible says the laws of the land should be obeyed and if one of the main tenets of this country specifies such, any religious bias should be removed. If you don’t agree with them then don’t have one. Allow those who might need it due to health or circumstance have access without contest.

    1. Johnny Doeseph says:

      I agree completely.

  25. Jim says:

    Oooh… big, messy topic! The one thing that is clear to me is that science does not have a firm grasp as to when life begins, and neither does religion. Oh, as individuals you all appear to know, but none of you seem to agree. We’ll shelve that argument for now.

    I have one very important question: WHO IS PAYING FOR THIS WOMAN’S ABORTION?

    Yes, I hear all the feminists screaming their faces off at me right now. But it matters. The article says she went to Planned Parenthood. Now, I’m not up on all the PP stuff, but I think they offer abortions to women at no charge, which means the government is paying for it, which means WE ALL ARE PAYING FOR IT! I have heard women say it is their right to have abortions. I happen to agree with you. The part that seems to elude all of you is having that right does not mean the government pays for it. We have the right to free speech, but the government doesn’t buy me a newspaper company, or a radio station, or even a website. We have the right to keep and bear arms, but the government doesn’t buy me a gun. I think you see where I’m going with this.

    If this woman wants a no-hassle abortion, she can make an appointment with whichever doctor she wants, have the procedure, and either submit through her insurance (assuming she has insurance), or pay for it herself. This is something that NEVER should have been paid for with government funds.

    1. Lili says:

      You’re in luck Jim, planned parenthood uses zero government dollars for abortion services, it is against the law for federal government to fund abortions.
      While PP does receive federal funding, it can only be used for the other 97% of services they offer that do not include abortion.

      1. Jim says:

        Awesome! Lili, thank you for educating me. Can you give me a few examples of what PP does cover, and are there services for men that would covered, such as prostate exams?

        1. Lili says:

          Jim, I don’t know how in depth Planned Parenthood covers men’s health services, I believe they are mostly women’s clinic. But men can have std and HIV tests, counseling and referrals for vasectomy, and receive free prophylactics. As for what else they do…my father was always self employed with no insurance, so my mom, sister, and I utilized PP for all of our gynecology needs. Pelvic exams, cancer screenings, Bladder or yeast infection treatment, regular routine stuff. None of us ever used prescription contraceptive or dealt with an std but if we needed help with either, I’m sure PP would’ve provided that service too. in my youth I had no idea of the controversy around PP, but was very happy they were there to provide my family with our typical female health care. In fact, when I was finally trying to conceive they did the testing on my husband and I to learn why we couldn’t, then referred my husband for a surgery to fix his swimmers. When I did conceive soon after that surgery, it was planned parenthood that did the pregnancy test and provided me with initial pre-natal care. Never once was abortion talked about or considered by anyone at PP. Truly, as a young woman, I would not have been able to have regular health exams without planned parenthood and maybe even owe them some credit for enabling my sons conception. I am a pro-life born again Christian, and while I hate abortion, I do not hate PP, they offer so much more than just abortions. In fact, supposedly less than 10% of their “business” is abortion. When I was in college, most of my girlfriends utilized PP for their health care, and none ever had an unplanned pregnancy or abortion. These are just my experiences, but what better to base conclusions on than your own experience, right? I feel like any media we see is biased one way or the other, the right condemning PP for being an “abortion clinic” and the left defending the “woman’s right to choose” it very rarely talks about the other valuable health care offered. Yet, as far as I know they are a full service gynecology clinic,which, like most other gynecologist offices, offers abortion services.

      2. John Owens says:

        Yeah, that’s all bullshit. They are an abortion mill and that is all they are. They don’t do anything else and it is a big fat lie that they do.

    2. John Owens says:

      Absolutely right, Jim

  26. Dawn Pisturino says:

    Anybody who wants an abortion should pay for it themselves — not the taxpayers! But abortion is exactly what Satan would condone.

    1. Richard says:

      The only thing sadder than an adult with an imaginary friend is an adult with an imaginary enemy. LOL

      Matthew 7

      stop ignoring the sacred book!

    2. Joe says:

      Federal Tax dollars do not fund abortions, ever. It’s illegal. In some states Medicaid, which is paid by local taxes, may provide abortions. However, some states now have a “special rule” that your tax dollars can be redirected to avoid funding that which you are morally opposed to. Perhaps ask your accountant about that.
      Btw, not only does Satan condone abortion, it surely revels in us all fighting about it….so self righteous in our beliefs, perfect opposition to the Father.

  27. Lili says:

    After reading all 26 pages of Missouris informed consent pamphlet, I see that this lawsuit it just another opportunity to make one more fight against Christianity.
    Firstly, they say life begins at conception. Ok, that’s something people argue, but really? that argument is lame. I mean, we call it life when we look for a single cell organism on another planet, but refuse to call a human embryo life…again, it’s a strategic fight against Christianity, and nothing else.
    The pamphlets states that at 22 weeks the fetus may be able to feel pain associated with the procedure….uh, duh! The nervous system is functioning and some babies can even survive (with assistance) when born at this age, yes, science does say a 22 week fetus can feel pain, exactly what the pamphlet says.
    And then they complain about the 72 hour wait period. Wow! The Satanist want to protect woman’s reproductive rights but think it’s unfair to require a few days to mull over all of the information she just received, while making one of the biggest decisions of her life. If they really cared for the woman, there would be only concern that she was making the right decision for herself, and 72 hours seems a reasonable amount of time.
    This is a ridiculous claim put out by an organization thats proclaimed purpose is opposing and oppressing Christianity.
    Ironically, there was absolutely nothing religious written on that pamphlet. Frivolous lawsuit.

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