The West Virginia state senate wants to put God back in public schools.
Earlier this week, the West Virginia state senate approved Senate Bill 251, which would mandate that every public school in the state – from kindergarten to university – put up a poster depicting the American flag, the West Virginia flag, and the phrase “In God We Trust.”
Should the bill become law, West Virginia will become just the latest state to display the national motto in public schools, following in the footsteps of states like Louisiana, Mississippi, Utah, and Texas.
Similar to other legislation, the West Virginia bill requires that the signs be displayed in a “conspicuous place” in full view, not hidden away in a broom closet or under a desk. To avert legal challenges, the posters must be donated, or purchased by the school with donated funds.
The bill’s authors say they just want to unify a divided country under the national motto, but secular activists and some parents say this is another attempt to sneak Christianity into public school.
God and Schools, Together Again
"We know there's a lot of kids that have problems at home, tough times at home that we don't know anything about," is how West Virginia State Sen. Mike Azinger argued for the bill on the floor of the Senate.
"Maybe they'll look up one day and say, 'In God We Trust' and know they can put their hope in God."
He says he just wants kids to know that they can “say God” in school.
But not the Christian God, necessarily. This is just a generic God they're talking about, supporters argue.
“It doesn’t go down to denominations or religious beliefs. Ultimately it just recognizes that there is a higher power than the human race,” explains bill co-sponsor State Sen. Vince Deeds, who also works as a Baptist pastor.
“That’s why President Eisenhower wanted to have this displayed on our currency back in 1956, I believe it was,” he said. “He felt it was important for us to remember where our position is and where our authority comes from.”
Azinger agrees. "[The national motto] was adopted during a time of disunity in America, at a time that unity was needed," he argues. "And I think that's where we are in America in many ways."
In God We Mandate
Not everyone is buying the argument that this is an attempt to unify.
“Some kids are not Christian and they are going to feel excluded because it says, ‘In God We Trust.’ Maybe they are, whatever religion they may be,” explained one parent. “I just don’t think it should be that way.”
The West Virginia ACLU opposes the bill, and says it’s a violation of the separation of church and state. "We understand that it's the national motto, but it's also something that makes a lot of people who are not religious feel very uncomfortable," says ACLU advocacy director Eli Baumwell. "It's just going to make a few people feel a little bit less welcome.”
Other critics argue that West Virginia has bigger education issues they should be dealing with than putting up posters. A recent study found West Virginia ranked dead last in a ranking of states by overall education quality, and bottom five for both K-12 education quality and university quality.
Regardless, the bill is advancing and will likely be signed into law. Legal challenges in states with similar laws have largely failed, thanks to careful wording in the bills themselves.
God is very likely coming to the halls of West Virginia schools very soon.
What do you make of this development?
170 comments
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Donald Michael Woodward
We need to remember the first admendment does state that the government shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. so as long as a religion is not forced on anyone, speaking about God is like anyother freedom of speech right. It does seem that freedom of speech is becoming a bad topic to talk about though.
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Donald Michael Woodward
Everyone needs an opportunity to think of God. Saying "In God We Trust" allows a person to think about what they know and understand of their God. Too many give that job over to others instead of reaching into their self to form a personal understanding with their God.
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Karsten S. A. Johansson
It's funny that religious people yammer on about separation of Church and State when the government tries to meddle with the Church. But nary a peep is heard when the Church tries to meddle with the State.
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John Alex Paxson
You will find all your answers when you die ... until then "IN GOD WE TRUST" ...... put it this way GOD = GOOD .... DEVIL = BAD .... I'm sure everyone can get a grip on that.
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Lionheart
You’ve been reading that book again haven’t you John? Do you always believe everything you read?
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Father Frederick
The nation was founded on the principles of God and religion, so I don't have a problem with it. But frankly the competition and angst of people is what will prevent it. One man's religion is another man's taboo. And let's face fact, many of the reason for beliefs are more akin to supporting a sporting team than an actual reading of texts, and studies in theology.
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Karsten S. A. Johansson
It absolutely was not. You are parroting a falsehood that gets repeated so very often, yet it doesn't take much research to realize the opposite is true.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
“ The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the Supreme Being as his father, in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.”. Thomas Jefferson
Does that sound like someone that has any respect for Christianity? There are many other similar statements that show Jefferson did not intend to establish the US as a ‘Christian country’.
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Maclin Vance
E Pluribus Unum "Out of Many, One" is the National Motto.
"In God We Trust" is Cold War Propaganda from the 1950's to distinguish "Godly" American Capitalism from Communism.
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Anisahoni
Thank you Maclin!
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Donald G Magel
MY GOD of course; all others are fake news.. ...according to some "religious" folks.
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Andrea Marie Fletcher
The sooner this world (every person given the breath of life) wakes up and realizes the truth of their existence and purpose, the better. The only truth is that GOD is real. The only one true GOD is The Trinity. Father, Son and Holy Spirit. HE loves us so much that He chose to give us life and sent his one and only son to die on the cross for us to pay the penalty of our sins. HE has created us to be in close relationship with HIM and to do HIS good work during the short amount of time that we are given here on earth. Denying the Word of GOD does not make it any less true.
This is a very good change. And everyone and everything will better because of it. I pray everyone sees this truth quickly and receives salvation. JESUS is the way, the truth, and the life, and no one comes to the FATHER except through JESUS. John 14:6
11 for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess1 to God.” 10 so that at the name of Jesus bevery knee should bow, cin heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Romans 14:11
The time is now to surrender your heart to LORD JESUS. Eternity comes down to Heaven or Hell. The decision is ours to make and the time is now.
Praying over these children and for all to come to CHRIST. It is our responsibility and blessing to raise up and lead the children to The LORD. 🙏❤️✝️
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Anisahoni
Lawdy, preaching? "sent his one and only son to die on the cross for us to pay the penalty of our sins" ?That is a sick and evil parent. If this was fact, then no one has any sin to be concerned about. right? "Eternity"?? What does that even mean? Where are heaven and hell? Which universe? On a planet? Which star systems? Figments of imagination and weird twisted fantasies. No thanks, Lord Jealous is a fantasy.
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Lionheart
Awe….bless you, Andrea. You are so disillusioned from reading that book, it’s quite amazing. Please don’t read the Harry Potter books, I’d hate for you to think those stories are real as well.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Preach, Sister!!
Just do it somewhere I don’t have to listen to your nonsensical babble.
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Elizabeth A Guynn
I don’t need it to be forced upon people that don’t want it. The teaching of the faith should come from within the homes. I don’t need the constitution or government to force faith. I believe in my God and as long as I’m comfortable with my faith and the teaching of my children that I do, I'm perfectly comfortable with that. So many time people leave it up to the schools to teach things that I personally feel should come from home. That’s just my person opinion.
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Tomas A. Komarek
The sign “In God we trust” prominently displayed at school suggests to the children that there is a state-sanctioned God and the “right” God is probably the one most of the other children worship. The majority rules – or at least it rules in some countries. There are about 2.8 billion Christians and 1.8 billion Muslims. Most Muslim states have a state-sanctioned God (Allah) and a religion enforced by the state. Do we want to be like the Muslim states – or more like the founding fathers who tried to avoid state-imposed beliefs and religion? After all, they freed themselves from state-imposed churches in 18th-century Europe. - Tom Komarek
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Rev. Jim Sutton
Look at every coin and paper bill you have. Every one has the MOTTO "In God We Trust" on them. Also, look up the definition of "motto," it has nothing to do with religion. Arizona's motto is "Ditat Deus" --- God Enriches. As long as the federal motto is not used to promote religion, and its appearance is clarified that it, like the flag, just represents our country, I have no problem with it being posted --- either voluntarily or required. Remember, if you carry ANY money, you're carrying "In God We Trust." Does that mean you're trying to promote, or force, religion on anybody? Absolutely not. So get off your high horses. "They wait for the thrill of being offended." John Cleese "Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right." Ricky Gervais
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William Fritz
I was reading a story a while back that made an interesting comment.
In the storyline, the character made the comment about how everyone in the new land seemed to respect everyone else's beliefs. The answer back was a long the lines that while there were many gods what had happened over the years was an integration of all the various god attributes into just one representing them all.
When religion is placed into the school and prayer is required the question comes back to which religious group are we going to use. That is a problem and a question.
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Gregory Leon Franklyn
This is a political movement about making Christianity the national religion. It's a step on the path towards making the United States a Christian theocracy. That would be fine with Christians, but excludes anyone else. I believe that there are as many ways home as there are people who want to go there. If God knows the dwindling number of hairs on my head, God certainly knows that different cultures have differing values. It's pure hubris to believe that no one gets home except through adopting western white heterosexual culture. Jesus wasn't white and western culture didn't even exist. I say, "Different strokes for different folks" might be more of the posture I would imagine of a Deity over all of creation. Surely God knows that we are different from one another in important ways and created different paths home that could be understood by each culture. I believe that's why there are different religions. The messages are all the same, just geared for different cultures.
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Rev. M H Smith
Most definitely In God we trust! To those who don't believe they should have no offensive feelings toward the signs, as if God doesn't exist, it shouldn't bother them at all. To the rest of us, praise and rejoice in his name that's his light is shining in West Virginia! If we teach children religion and the bible and how to pray, maybe, So many wouldn't wind up in a bad situation, make poor life choices, or ending up in prison, and learning there what religion the bible and finding God means...
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Anisahoni
I didn't want my children traumatized by reading the historical bible, a collection of myths in which god is an evil, murderous, infanticidal, jealous entity. Killing, torture, slavery. No thanks. The mythical bible doesn't teach children how to make good choices. Loving and responsible parents teach them right from wrong, doing good works and helping others, being antiracists and anti homophobes.
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Candy Wehenkel
Why are you responding if you feel this way.
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Anisahoni
Why do you ask such a question? If you don't like my words, just move along.
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Brian Oaksford
God should not go in the classroom. There are people of other religions
going to school. There shouldn’t just be a celebration of one religions god.
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Tamela R. Jordan
Yes, “In God we Trust” should be in schools. Teach academics and real history. Do not leave anything out. If you forget the errors in our history you will repeat in a different form. Trust in God is what our history was built upon. Church does not rule, but you can trust in your god, whomever it is, because there is a separation of Church and State. In America you get to choose who your god will be that is apart of freedom.
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Anisahoni
Our history and country was built upon greed, genocide and theft. Yes, Let's tell the truth, tell the facts and not whitewash genocide by those who held a cross in one hand and a sword in the other. Those early churches supported slavery of indigenous peoples as well as those forced here from African and Caribbean nations.
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Richard Faust
Destructive Doctrines 2 Peter 2:1-7 But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. 2 And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3 By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction [a]does not slumber.
Doom of False Teachers 4 For if God did not spare the angels who sinned, but cast them down to [b]hell and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved for judgment; 5 and did not spare the ancient world, but saved Noah, one of eight people, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood on the world of the ungodly; 6 and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7 and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8 (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)— 9 then the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations and to reserve the unjust under punishment for the day of judgment,
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Lou Everett, Sr.
What does church have to do with putting God back in the classroom? We are talking about "God," here. Not church, Christian or otherwise.
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Mary
Okay well if we are going to go this route then many gods names should be used also even Satan. Put up In Satan we trust too right next to them.
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Richard Faust
Satan is an angel not a god, unless you ask him.
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Karsten S. A. Johansson
Anything/anybody you worship becomes a god.
Satan can easily be described as "a superhuman being or spirit worshiped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity." so clearly he is a god to some people
Psalm 82:6: “I said, ‘You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.’
John 10:34: Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods"’?
Exodus 7:1: And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet.
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Bishop William Dusenberry, DD
It appears that Rev Brown (I’ve assumed that she’s a reverend) is treating the Christian Jesus, as we Secular Humanist Pantheists treat our Secular Humanist Pantheist God — both consider Jesus and God as a synonymous with nature.
One all of humankind coalesces around this obvious logical, provable, scientifically demonstrable God — because the Christian God is only make-believe, then humankind can be united behind having a God in whom to attribute everything that humankind currently doesn’t have answers for.
As in “how did everything begin (start).
Christians, such as Rev Brown, answer “how did all that we know begin?” With “the Christian God created everything” which makes them happy — until — you ask the following logical follow up question: Who created the Christian God?” — for which there’s never been an agreed upon answer.
God, Jesus, Zeus, Jupiter, Zarathustra and Elvis Presley — are all gods to some people, and some more than others.
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Carrol Ann Brown
I believe that our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ is everywhere. Therefore, the spirit of the living God cannot be stopped. Student should have the choice to take religious classes of all faiths, and they can decide their path. But you must believe to achieve the spirit and wonders of the living God.
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Lionheart
Awe…..bless you, Carrol. Please get well from your religious indoctrination.
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Lorraine Lynn Innes
So much hate. So much I want it my way. No matter what “title” or word you want to use there is only one God. To see this much hate is so sad to my heart. There is only ONE true God.
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
for it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.”
Be careful of the seed you see for one day you shall reap them and answer for them.
Lastly,
John. 13. A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
There are far worse things to think about than this. If your child was facing death today, would you not cry out to God to save that child?
May all come to understand the one true God and no be misled by man’s tradition.
May in God we all trust.-
Richard Faust
Good
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Donald Richard Starns
A bar I used to frequent had a sign on the cash register: “In God We Trust—-All Others Pay Cash”. It’s be fine with me if a dollar bill were stuck up in classrooms. That’s the real god right there.
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Carla Jakola Smith
Perhaps WV, should spend the advertising money on items and staff that will ACTUALLY IMPROVE THEIR EDUCATION SYSTEMS!!
Gods and Goddesses have absolutely nothing to do with the ability of a school system to meet the needs of their students.
When your state is DEAD LAST in educational funding and test scores, as well as graduation rates and college graduates - blowing tax dollars for a logo which came about during the Communist Red Scare under Senator Joe McCarthy in the 1950’s.
We are seeing that xenophobia and racism again. As a child born in 1965, I grew up with forced busing; with cross burnings; and I live in my home state of North Carolina where humongous Confederate Battle flags fly alongside the interstates.
We need UNITY as a country, not more divisive rhetoric. Perhaps something along the lines of:
We are ALL of ONE RACE - THE HUMAN RACE
And leave the Gods and Goddesses out of it. Of the 5,000+ Gods being worshipped on this planet, NO ONE has the right to determine who someone else worships. And if there was only 1 God - account for the thousands of interpretations by various cultures across eons.
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Ronaldo
This article specifically states that the signs must be donated or must be purchased with donated money. No tax dollars will be used to purchase them.
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Steven Ferrell
I think this is great. Our public schools have become nothing but indoctrination centers for a godless, pure liberal agenda.
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Tonia Lynn Johnson
Everyone no matter what faith they believe in or practice has a GOD or a source that they refer to or look upon. GOD is who you as an individual believe in. A representation of faith in a higher power. So no matter what GOD you believe in I think bringing that sense of hope and something to trust in is very important to our young people who may feel hopeless. ✌🏽❤️
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Warren Calvin Wall
They left out the second part of that phrase. "In God we Trust, all others pay cash."
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Cynthia Fields
We all need God period. I believe that you should be able to pray when and where you choose. Nobody has the right to try to keep God out of anything!!! This world needs more praying .
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Rev. B
What is a "god period". Sounds dirty.
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Lionheart
Praying didn't go down very well in that earthquake city, or even during the Holocaust, Cynthia. But oh well, let's talk to the wall, floor, or ceiling (depending on where you think your god is hiding to listen to you) to help those poor families that are left. 🤷🏼
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Brent Jude LeBouef
God has never left us. We walk away. Our sin is going to cause problems. The sovereignty of God is relentless and can not be ignored. We will go through birth pains. Let God's will be done. Regardless we are to enjoy our new lives in Christ and stop worrying about trivial things in the dying world. I believe God will make his presence known when he is ready, not a moment before.
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Merlin
Freedom to believe or not to believe and no "pressure" to do either from the government. Any statement by any government applies "pressure".
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Ronaldo
I'm less concerned about whether or not the government says I have to worship, or I cannot, or I must do it in a specific way than I am concerned that the government is now saying I must accept someone who pretends to be a woman as identical in all ways to a real female. Several laws now state that.
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Mark
It won't make a shred of difference to anything either way. It will have novelty value as someone sticks up a poster or paints it on a wall but will soon blend in to be an irrelevance nobody notices anymore. Meanwhile, the 'almighty' has just bumped off several thousands of highly religious followers in the Turkish/Syrian earthquakes and the most common response? Pray to God for there being survivors and thank God for being merciful. You're worried about sticking a few meaningless words up in a school where the majority of the teachers wouldn't know where Turkey or Syria are on a map?
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
No, god shouldn’t “go to school”. But the people who believe in him should.
Many of the founding fathers were less than fully religious. And the constitution is worded just have a separation between the church and state. So, no, God should not be in schools.
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Daniel Gray
There is NO separation of church and state and never has been. The Constitution was ratified in 1787 and the first mention of this myth was in 1802, a good 15 years AFTER the Constitution became law of the land. So for this myth to be in the constitution it would have taken a constitutional amendment. Now I challenge ANYONE to show me where and when that amendment was passed or even sent to the states.
Secondly in the Newdow cases ruled on by the US Supreme Court, they ruled that the pledge does NOT name any one deity specifically and as such it is NOT illegal NOR is it a violation of any federal law or document. So all the complaining by the people saying otherwise amounts to nothing more then their opinion.
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Tom
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." in the First Amendment creates a separation between the government and religion. This is called a "separation of church and state" because that is what those words created. If the government can't pass laws that elevate one religion over another and they can't prohibit the free exercise of a religion, the state is, in effect, separated from the church. Why is this so hard for you to comprehend?
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Ronaldo
The free exercise of religion means that the State can worship anyway it wishes, just as the People, who make up the membership of that State, can. The State is prohibited from interfering with that worship, but that does not make it completely separate from it. When Thomas Jefferson first wrote the words "a wall of separation between Church and State", it was in answer to the Danbury Baptist Association's concern that they would be replaced with an official religion. Jefferson never demanded that all politicians turn away from God or religion. Had he envisioned a true and complete separation, he would have. Instead, he said there should be no religious test applied to any candidate for an elected office.
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Tom
No, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion" does not mean the state can worship how they want. In fact, it specifically prevents the state from practicing religion because doing so would require them to make a law respecting an establishment of religion.
You are correct about the origin of the phrase "a wall of separation between Church and State" but you seem to be excluding the important context of what creates this wall of separation: the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment.
For that context: "I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."
Jefferson, one of the men who wrote The Constitution, is explicitly stating here that by adopting the First Amendment, the American people, with The Constitution, have built a wall of separation between Church & State."
You are correct that this does not prevent individual politicians from practicing religion or believing in God, but it does prevent state run public schools from worshiping a specific religion. If a state begins practicing a specific religion by law, they would be in conflict with the First Amendment.
Being that many religious practices do not believe in a higher power, and "One Nation Under God" infers the Abrahamic "God", not just "a god", I would argue that constitutes establishing the Christian religion over all others.
If you wish to debate my final point, there is a reasonable discussion to be had. To debate any of the other points I outline is directly in conflict with the intentions of the Founding Fathers when they founded this nation.
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Daniel Gray
Comment has been removed.
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Mary Haviland
There isn't supposed to be a separation of church and state. Where in the constitution does it say that there should be or is a separation of church and state? The answer is, there isn't, because there is none. The phrase was suggested as a way to not have state required religion, not that religion should be separate from religion. In fact all kings who were considered as great and successful kings would alw% listen to and do what they or yhwy prophets would advise them to do. They us the ultimate king maker. We the founders of the country were most definitely Christians. They prayed to ywhy for guidance to form the !ew country, even George Washington even prayed before crossing the Delaware in the revolutionary war. In fact to not have religion in the government is communism and Marxism. And remember we do have the constitution in the courts if Congress. You all that believes otherwise don't know what you are talking about.
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Mary
Totally unconstitutional. Just proves that once again sociopathic republicans only care about themselves and pushing their agenda.
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Mary
Which god?
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Lionheart
I’m thinking they mean Zeus, Mary. They could mean Dionysus though, the God of Wine. The US are big wine drinkers. 🍷
Didn’t I read a fable somewhere where Zeus turned water into Wine, or was that someone else 🤔
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Elizabeth Blackthorn
High school boys= Pan.
Just add horns to the poster, my friends. Who says there's no prayer in school?!
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pjm
What makes this even more ludicrous than it seems at the surface is that "getting God into the classrooms" is pushed primarily by evangelical Christians -- and it is exactly the opposite of what Jesus taught. He said to keep the church and state separate (render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and unto God that which is God's). And even more starkly in contrast to these people trying force God on school children is that in his Sermon on the Mount, Jesus said, "And when you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they will be seen by people. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full. But as for you, when you pray, go into your inner room, close your door, and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees what is done in secret will reward you."
It cannot be any clearer than that. Jesus himself called those people hypocrites who attempt to force their religion publicly on others. An why? Because it drives people away, it doesn't draw them in.
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Patricia Ihnat Hughes
I think it's a wonderful attempt to put the Bible back in our schools. I've seen what is a terrible problem in jails and prison first hand and experienced it myself people of any age that are not given the chance to read the Bible, just what happens to them. It's truly awful to not know a healthy spiritual path in life.
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Lionheart
I’ve read the Bible, Patricia. That’s why I’m now a secular humanist, and it’s definitely not a book for children. Too much horror and bloodshed with beatings, stoning, killing, drowning, eternal damnation of fire etc,. Know what I mean? Harry Potter books have better stories for children.
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Brent Jude LeBouef
Do you think that there is a place anyone can hide from God if you walked away from God you know his power in your life is there anywhere you can run? If you read the Bible. I question you have you ever seen so much forgiveness and what God gave up for you? The Bible is not a book of instruction but a love letter to his chosen people which is us. The times are upon us we will have to make a choice I ask you could you give you child up for a stranger. My God did and it was for you!!!
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Lionheart
You’re only quoting stories from a book, Brent. If your god was really omnipotent, he’d have the power to heal the sick little children in cancer wards, prevent little children from being squashed to death in that earthquake, and he’d even be able to show up just to put away any doubts people have in other religions.
Yes, I’ve read the book, Brent, and those tales are full of a very murderous, pestilential, jealous, genocidal, infanticidal brute of a god, or did you skip over those parts in that book and just read the loving bits.
Try telling the mothers, if you could, of those first born he killed, that he represents a love letter. If anyone is hiding, Brent, it’s not me, I’m here for real, as are you, it’s your god that’s hiding, and I think, deep down, you know why. He obviously doesn’t exist! 🤷🏼
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Brent Jude LeBouef
I understand your unbelief. The truth is you are not ready to see. My God cannot hide while creating sunset, delivering peace, and performing the things we choose not to give him praise for. If you choose to see the broken then that is where you will stay. Like childbirth, there is pain, but after is the birth of a brand new baby. See the child that was spared in the rubble. I have troubles as well. Mine is my son. How would I feel if he took him from me? I would hurt so bad, and this scares me. But when I remember who I was, the drug-using womanizer then, Jesus found me and changed me now, boasting a degree in ministry and going into psychology. Then, I know there is a God because he has a plan for me. I am saying God can fight his battles, and he will see beyond someone bashing him on a blog because he is God. Your creator!
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Lionheart
I don’t think so, Brent. I’ve been where you currently are. I’ve preached from the pulpit. I’ve baptised. I’ve said the exact same things as you…..and then…..I came to the reality that it’s all a lie.
I totally understand you won’t accept that, because I’ve been where you are, and your belief structure won’t change until you face the fact, using logic, reason, and critical thought, that you have been duped. There is NO demonstrable evidence any god is real, even yours. You are convincing yourself of a lie, because you feel good about the story. If that’s what you want to do, stay on that path until you feel able to heal yourself, and not rely on fictional stories to support your inability to truly heal yourself.
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Brent Jude LeBouef
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Brent Jude LeBouef
If you have been where I am, sister, you would not be speaking against God's word. I understand you have been hurt or your pride is in the way we will not understand everything, and that is okay our pain is either revealing a beautiful truth or a moment we must go through. Either way, you can not sway my faith. The fire has purified me, and I am sure there is more to come, but I am blessed, and this world will not convince me otherwise.
God will have his way. He is sovereign. I will leave you with this where were you when I laid the foundations of the universe? He spoke to Job in 38:4. So why does a created being say anything about their lives? But he considers us anyway.
Any answer by our faith says it takes faith to believe or not. I can not change your mind I understand that only God can.
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Lionheart
Thank you “sister” but I have truly seen the way of truth, and your way, that only relies on faith, is not the way. Your way is no different to every other religion on earth that only relies on faith, that convinces them they have the truth. Mormons, Islamists, etc., are the same as you. They all are relying on their faith that they have the truth. You will insist you do, Mormons will insist they do.
Try using logic, reason, and critical thought, and you will see you have been duped, just like I was.
🦁❤️
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Lionheart
Teach children critical thinking skills and you can persuade them to believe whatever you can substantiate. Seduce and terrorize children with fantasies, punish their dissent, and reward their submission, and you can groom them to believe whatever you want them to believe.
These are the tactics of all religions to get them to toe the line. It’s called…indoctrination.
🦁❤️
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Rev. B
But therein lies a problem, my dear Lion-hearted one. How can parents teach critical thinking skills when they lack them themselves?
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Mary Haviland
To minister eil#on, I never am not sure if some of what you have said that I said. I know I never said anything about Jewish lazors because I don't know who has control if the lazors. I know the founding fathers wanted to name this country new Jerusalem. They were christians, everything about our constitution is based off of Christian values. We even still have the 10 commandments on the walls of Congress. They were christians. Just just didn't want to force a Christian government into everybody just the kinghood they left did. And it wasn't even that it was Christianity, which they were, it was the kind of Christianity also. They wanted people to be able to choose what kind of Christianity they wanted to be, ect. That's what the issue was.
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Tom
"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." -- Treaty of Tripoli https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Tripoli#Article_11
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding...." --Thomas Jefferson in a letter to John Adams
The United States of America is, and always has been, a secular nation. Religion is not mentioned in the constitution at all, except in the First Amendment where they specifically state that the Government cannot respect one religion over the other nor can they prohibit the free exercise of a religion: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
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Lionheart
Comment removed by user.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
Orthodox and fundamentals have been guilty of that for years.
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Lionheart
Pretty much all religions actually. Thank you for your comment. 🤗
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Stacey Owens
It is written, all are called but few are chosen. The WORD OF GOD IS LIFE not a man made law. Again, as it is written, the letter kills but the spirit give life.
Those who are making mandates must first walk in the spirit of Christ. Christ is the life and the life is God unto salvation, because God is a consuming fire. Not mans political will.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
God is love. Forget the hell and damnation tripe the church has indoctrinated into people.
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Mary
Which god!? o.O
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Barbara Harris
Ah, the days of communism taking over the world. Having been born in the 50s I remember the days of the Pledge every morning. Like over night we would be corrupted by communism. And then came the uproar over prayer in school. In the public school I went to we never had prayer in school. Not saying there weren't a lot of teachers before entering the class room saying prayers to make it through the day with us. I mean we were little monsters - eating chalk, throwing school paste at each other, boys putting bugs in girls desk cubby, rough housing on the jungle gym. But back then I only knew one school mate who was being raised by a single mother. She had lost her husband in Korea.
If we misbehaved too bad it meant sitting outside the principal's office while being glared at by the secretary. All the while the principal was calling to our home and telling what had happened. Then we faced an angry parent. And then mom would make us sit in the corner till my dad got home and now we had to face their "anger" at our misbehaving. All this without a single prayer or "In God We Trust" in the school. We behaved. Fifty years later at my high school reunion we all relived those days.
So where have things gone wrong. I lay it at the feet of the parents. They won't or don't discipline. And I'm not talking the "spare the rod, spoil the child" bunch. We, maybe received a swat on a well padded back side, but it was more of the embarrassment that we had let our parents down. Respect started in the home.
My family was, in a loose sense of the word Christian. My mom would read the bible to us at night until she gave up on me with all my "scientific" questions. And as time went on I found my path as a Pagan.
Do I think that "In God We Trust" has a place in schools. No I don't. Schools are a place of learning about life, science, math and the things that will give a person skills to excel in life outside of school. Trusting in a spiritual presences may bring some people solace but it won't prepare them to face life's ups and downs. Respect, honesty, caring, knowledge and honor will do more to stem the tide of violence then a simple phrase tacked on a wall somewhere.
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Diane Minna LaFave
Most people and Faiths believe in God . Our Country was born by that Faith. YES ! Bring God back to the schools. I went to school in Flint, Mi.. in fact, a verse from the Bible was read over the intercom every morning . I was one of those readers.
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Mary Haviland
This is a great thing, e!ough is enough of catering to all you ungodly people. If you don't like God in s, the move or reach your kids at home like the god loving people have to do. Plus your ungodly ideology is ruining the. Country by making this country an ungodly country. God will not favor us if we take him out of our society. And I don't care If you believe in God or not. This is a Christian country, =ather you like it or not, this country was founded by christians and with christian values. So maybe you need to learn to live God or leave. A country that don't have God in it is communist, Marxist, and if that is what you are, then your an enemy of the country. And we should not coddle our enemies. You are luciferians. And there for evil.
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Minister Wilson
Mrs. Haviland
Okay
Weren't you the same people clamoring for a "Muslim" ban? Aren't you with the same people supporting representatives that claim Jewish space lasers set fire in California
Aren't you with the same elk that refused to wear masks for your fellow citizens and called Corona virus the Chinese flu?
Why didn't the founding fathers just claim that this country was a christian country? Because the Constitution clearly does not say so.....
Refrain from trying to spread your delusions upon others...that's what fascist do
And please, just stop making stuff up because you identify as christian...
claiming to identify as a christian does not give you any more or less "values" than anyone else...
Plus, I see that your characterizing anyone who does not think and believe as you and your elk do as the "enemy" ...thus setting a really good example for "christian love" huh,
So, explain why the founding fathers didn't just state that this is a christian nation, why does it need to be inferred by deluded individuals such as yourself...?
Minister Wilson
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Stacey Owens
Furthermore, God doesn't need defending. He is in control. Your luciferian statement proves who your god is. Jesus said you are from beneathe yet Christ is from above not a christians. I know who I am in Christ. Christ does not divide because He does everything the Father has taught him and showed him. Christ is the Life. Not the Christain life.
If you believe that prayer must be put in schools then every one who operates under this mandate must live the life of Christ. They can't be in the flesh and spirit. As it is written, God will spew them out. They must become living sacifices, Holy and acceptible unto God which is your reasonible service unto to God. They must be SPIRIT LED, or the prayer is void.
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Stacey Owens
This has nothing to do with trusting God, Its about money and religion, it's only to serv GOP, thats why its a mandate. Their making the children and parents serv the system. This is "The Mark of the Beast". The system is religion.
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Sandra A Rasmussen
If you don’t believe that prayer should be back in schools like it used to be, then maybe you shouldn’t spend money because it has “in God we trust” all over it!
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Lionheart
Yes, most of us put our trust in the god Dionysus (the god of wine and pleasure) with our love of alcohol. The US are big wine drinkers, among many other drinks of course. At least Dionysus did kill anyone, unless you can tell me differently 🤔
There have been some very naughty gods though that have pretended to love people, even though they seemed to get pleasure out of killing them, or hurting them.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Sandra, it has never had any such thing on any of the credit or debit cards I've ever had. And I wouldn't touch that nasty paper money. It could have been handled by people with all kinds of contagious illnesses and diseases. Anyone who touches that money better quickly wash their hands with soap and water every time!
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Sandra A Rasmussen
If you don’t believe that prayer should be in schools like it used to, I guess maybe you shouldn’t spend money either, because in every bill, and on every coin, it says “in God, we trust”
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Minister Wilson
Rasmussen,
Ya,
That's why I use electronic currency...
My Debt card doesn't say dribble like that...
I thought jesus kicked over the money tables, now you seem to be proud of that sort of blasphemy.
Minister Wilson
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Minister Wilson
So,
It's okay to indoctrinate young children into "god" but not expose them to reality like perhaps gender...
I think these actions orchestrated by "right wing christian nationalist fascist" speaks for itself. And anyone who doesn't see the clear hypocrisy is part of the problem...
"school is about education, right?" " let kids learn about god/gods at home from their parents, right?" "posting in god we trust is not age appropriate, right?" "what about the young impressionable atheist students that might be offended or have their feelings hurt, right"
I, like an increasing number of people are getting sick of this blatant two faced dribble...
If the saying truly is a "neutral" then " In Satan We Trust" should be represented as well...
Ya know teach em both sides right (Slavery, Holocaust, Etc. Etc.)
Nefarious Rascals the whole hypocritical lot,
Minister Wilson
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Rev Ned
The “In God We Trust” added to everything is an anachronism dating back to the 1950s when we were fighting the “Godless Commies”. The GOP likes to live in the past when everything was rosy, but they seem to forget that the income tax rate on their pals, like Musk and Bezos, was 90%.
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Ronaldo
Neither Musk nor Bezos had yet been born when taxes were that high, much less being taxed at that rate. Besides, according to government figures, about 10,000 US citizens, out of about 43 million, paid taxes at 81% or better, or about 0.02% of the population. Far fewer were paying 91%.
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Asa William Sprague, II
Certainly some students will ask teachers what the motto means and why it was chosen.
This could lead to some interesting conversations (and observations) when the individual responses provided by each of the tens of thousands of West Virginia teachers begin stirring things up.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
If I was a school teacher I would do one of two things. Simply walk out mid year and leave them trying to replace a chem/physics teacher OR contact a lawyer and sue.
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Daniel Gray
on what grounds? SCOTUS already ruled this was legal and constitutional in the Newdow decisions so how do you think that you would win? Answer is you cant, so please stop with the huffing and puffing and empty threats
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Walking out mid-year is huffing and puffing? It wasn’t mid-year but immediately before the term began when I left a university with the problem of finding someone to replace me.
Oh, you just focused on the one aspect of my post! Ahh, forgot about your cherry picking tendencies. Actually it would be unlikelyI would be teaching in any ackbassward area such as this.
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Daniel Gray
I stated fact. No matter if you did it with or without huffing and puffing, you do it once and you would not have to come back again as you would be terminated. And It makes no difference if you have "tenure" or not because even having that when you walk off your job for such a stupid reason you CAN and SHOULD be terminated. No other employer allows you to do this.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
You misunderstand yet again. Walk off never to come back.
Put your hands together, you know, like when you’re talking to your imaginary friend, and put them into a bucket of water. I know, pull your hands out of the water really quickly and watch how fast the water closes up. Takes the same amount of time for me to find a another job.
A job once at the end of the school year. Went and spent the summer in Jamaica and came back after about 10 weeks. Actually came back on on Wednesday, found out about a job opening on a Thursday went for the interview on Friday and started teaching on Monday. After negotiating an issue during the summer failed I informed them I wouldn’t be back at the start of the new semester. Went out to a bar that night and salt the head of the state’s high school sports medicine division. He told me about a job opening in the city where they needed a chemistry and physics instructor and someone to start a sports medicine program. I went for an interview the following week and had an immediate job offer, which I took.
Getting a new job there’s not a problem.
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Daniel Gray
Then do it and hush. I have already shown you were wrong by the Constitution and by the US Congress and by the US Supreme Court, so your continued complaining wot help. So if you dont like your working area, then go ahead and quit but if you want to try and say that all of the above are wrong because you say so, its going to be a very lonely life from here on out.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Oh, isn’t that special? Gray thinks he can tell people to hush!
West Virginia is a hotbed of inbred, ignorant, Pentecostal hillbillies whose religious delusions are so extreme they dance with rattlesnakes. Anything they decide to do in schools doesn’t surprise me. I’ve only passed through WV once and you damn sure won’t find me working in such a place.
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Daniel Gray
So you are getting upset when the SCOTUS has ruled more then once that you are wrong? Or that the Congress has shown you are wrong? Or that federal Law has shown that you are wrong? You cant chage any of this and yet here you are going on and on and on about something you have already been proved wrong about so continuing is a waste of oxygen and just like your parents and teachers told you when you seemingly dont want to accept the simple fact that you are wrong and go on and on and on, just hush. Its a waste of time and space for you to continue. You want it changed then go to law school and get appointed to the SCOTUS or elected to congress and then try and change it but complaining about it here does no good. Not that hard to see that point so whats your major malfunction that you cant? But then again since you are so upset that you cant change anything and have been proved wrong, you start in with the insults which just goes to show what a low level of intelligence you must have.
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James Riggle-Johnson
Maybe they should have passed a bill that ensures the kids CAN read before the put up a sign the want them to read.
Rather than asking them to trust God, they should ask them to trust their teachers. Tell them they can talk to their teachers about “ANYTHING” without fear of their parents finding out. Maybe they need to talk about the abuse their suffering at home. It doesn’t matter what... they need a safe place to talk about things they can’t talk to their parents about.
Stop worrying about pictures of Rainbows and start worrying about the students. God has nothing to do with it. If parents want their children to “trust God” then they should teach it to them, not the school.
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Colleen McAllister
The motto appears on our coins and cash. I see no harm in the posting. Everyone is getting a bit sensitive these days. It isn't being mandated to be posted on every wall or even a specific place. Only that it be posted. Chill out everyone.
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James Riggle-Johnson
They need to make sure the children can read before they post signs about trusting God. Their parents should be talking to them about God. It's not the schools responsibility. They should be teach them about math, history, and reading. Teach them social skills so they can navigate life once they've graduated.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
Maybe teach them why believing in science is more reasonable.
I want to talk biology class in a rural North Carolina town. I taught a section on evolution. When I announced that we would be studying evolution, one girl said that she’s not “listening to no devil’s teachin“ and put her head on her desk. I told her that was fine, but the section would be taught as part the course and the material would be on the test.
I was like thought the subject. She actually started to listen and became attentive. One day she told me that she had gone home and told her parents that there was “evolution kinda made sense”.
I saw a lot of students over the course of my tenure as a teacher that opened their minds a bit. I have no idea if those doors stayed open, opened yet, or were slammed shut by the closed minded, willfully ignorant, religious bigots that we all live with on a constant basis.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
James, I agree with you emphatically!
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Minister Wilson
Hey Mrs McAllister,
They only mandated for people to wear masks in stores, trains, airplanes,etc.
Not in your car, or at home...
So did you just "chill out"?,
Did you and your fellow Maga comrades just "chill out" if not, why not?
So, I guess a mandate that every school post that religious dribble is not really a "mAnDate" if it does not apply to every wall in the school...
Intellectually dishonest much?
Minister Wilson
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Mary E Benoit
The law separates church and state. No prayer in school. Teach and practice meditation to calm students. We can pray any time, anywhere silently but not force others to join at school or city hall. Keep your church out of my face!
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Mary E Benoit
The law separates church and state. No prayer in school. Teach and practice meditation to calm students. We can pray any time, anywhere silently but not force others to join at school or city hall. Keep your church out of my face!
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Ronaldo
Which law separates church and state? The Constitution does not, and our Founding Fathers had no such idea in mind.
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Mary E Benoit
The law separates church and state. No prayer in school. Teach and practice meditation to calm students. We can pray any time, anywhere silently but not force others to join at school or city hall. Keep your church out of my face!
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Diane Minna LaFave
You are misunderstanding the Constitution on this subject. It reads that the Government cannot interfere with the church [ the church is not limited. ] When "they" closed down the churches "they" were breaking the "law" . In the turmoil of covid 13 we needed what the church offers . We need God to give us the strength and guidance to make it through the insanity that is still going on. They allowed one person to file a suit to stop having God in schools [ she was an atheist ] . She won !! That was ridiculous ! Our Courts were tainted even then. The Judge was wrong and this "law " needs to be thrown out.
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pjm
No, the courts were not tainted. The Constitution ensures both freedom OF religion and freedom FROM religion being mandated by the government. Thomas Jefferson is the one who interpreted the First Amendment’s religion clauses as reflecting the view of “the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall between church and State.”
And it's the same thing that Jesus said. "Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and unto God that which is God's." He also told his followers to not be "like the hypocrites" who loved to pray in public to be seen by man, but rather to go into their closet and pray in secret, where God hears their prayers. Those parents who wish to teach their children about their religion and religious traditions have absolute freedom to attend the religious establishment of their choice and to teach their children about their religion at home. Public schools are not churches, synagogues or mosques. -
Mary
Which god!?
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Mary, take your pick. You can apply it to any of them.
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Carl Patrick Edwards
If they want to truly be inclusive of all religions, it should read, “In Gods We Trust”. But it isn’t meant to be inclusive. It’s West Virginia, we all know what god they mean.
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Lori-Ann Neeb
We do need God but not a God attached to a y one faith or religion. No religion has the right to try to force it's private dogma on others. God is not in a building or book. We need to look to the truth in the spiritual soul within us.
if those signs come with mandated religious dogma, they are wrong and have no place in schools. Tell your children they can silently pray any way their faith dictates without forcing anything on anyone else. -
Cyril R. VanKeirsbelk
The actual text is "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
Technically the national motto itself is a violation of the 1st Amendment, but that was conveniently overlooked in the past.
Can't respect it, can't prohibit the free exercise of it. So anything that requires anyone to put "God" on anything is a violation. That's a good thing because it prevents anyone in government from telling you who or how to worship.
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Lyle Roy Gleason
Just exactly WHEN did " IN GOD WE TRUST" become our national motto??? I know that in 1956 Eisenhower inserted the words "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance not for any social/religious reason, but as a clever way of ferreting out hidden Communists, who would hesitate to say those words. I have coins dating back to before the Civil War, and they do NOT include "IN GOD WE TRUST" anywhere on them! Did Eisenhower have them added at that time, or were they inserted earlier? Anyone out there have an answer for me?
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Daniel Gray
1956 is when it became our National Motto and this was upheld as Constitutional and legal by no less then the US Supreme Court in their Newdow decisions and the reason is they ruled in a 7-2 decision that it does not specifically mention any specific god, so the phrase is ambiguous.
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Ronaldo
Worshipping God on your own is one thing, but being forced to worship Him, or deny Him, in a specific fashion is why the First Amendment was written. Our Founding Fathers had no problem with people worshipping, but they did have a problem with the Church of England, which only allowed certain forms of worship. If the majority of the People in a given school district want to have this sign in their classrooms, denying their right to put it there is a violation of their "free exercise thereof" to practice their religion, and thereby a violation of the Constitution. Those who do not follow their belief are not required to trust God.
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Tom
It's not a group of people in a school district passing this, is the state legislature.
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Mary
No one has the power to take any god away from you. If god was taken away from during covid the only one to blame is yourself. What people WILL do is stop you from killing other human beings and that's why churches were closed down. My god it is a MIRACLE we are living through this pandemic but life isn't good enough you always want more!? Shame on you just shame! COVID kills and it's a very horrible way to die how you'd want to put anyone through that because of your own sociopathic reasons is degrading to the entire human race.
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Thomas A. Follis
Wow Diana. You nailed it.
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Thomas A. Follis
Wow Diana. You nailed it.
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Rev Ned
Actually, the 1st Amendment says the government shall not establish a religion. It says nothing about not taxing them, which, IMHO we should be doing, like any other business. The business of “Christian” religions is selling the hope of eternal life. That said, Joel Osteen might be selling the hope of worldly treasure.
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
It’s not actually a ‘law’ but within the constituton.
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David Cox
Tell that to God on judement day....he loves you enough to send his only son to die for your sins and you spit in his face by your hateful words. Turn from your sins and he will forgive you
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Lionheart
Truth sounds like hate to those who hate truth, David.
As there is no demonstrable evidence to prove your god is real, all you are doing is quoting stories, and fables, that you’ve read in a book.
Try reading a better book that doesn’t contain any religious blackmail of an imaginary judgment day. You might find the Harry Potter series of books, a better read. They don’t contain the condoning of slavery, or stoning people to death.
🦁❤️
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Anisahoni
David, You might be interested in books written by Zachariah Sitchin Since you seem angry and actually believe your god has a face, try understanding the Anunnaki as written by ancient Sumerians way before Constantine paid scribes to write the myths of the historical bible. Stephen King wrote that he could never write a horror book as terrorizing and horrific as the bible as it is filled with violence and a god who is jealous, murderous, and hateful supposed "creator." Certainly not an entity anyone should put any "hope" to as stated in the article.
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David Cox
Tell that to God on judement day....he loves you enough to send his only son to die for your sins and you spit in his face by your hateful words. Turn from your sins and he will forgive you
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Danny D. Maynard
Which God, once more? The term "God" is just a job title. There are 43 mentioned in the Christian Bible, 250 being worshipped in the United States in 2023, and about 2,500 worldwide. Please use the name of your chosen deity.
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Anisahoni
What kind of a parent would send his only son to be killed and claim it's for everyone's sin then and in the future? A sick and evil creature and fantasy by a sick man. If there is any modicum of fact or reality in this whole god business, then no one since "his" son died for everyone, has sinned and there is no cosmic court or judge. Religion has caused more damage to people around the world and has not changed the destructive invader ideology against those who are different.. Early Europeans were pagans until a fool decided to create it and mandate monotheism to make people comply with their laws out of fear. If someone wants to pray, no one can stop them. Prayer is a silent meditation and these chest thumpers just want to force their beliefs and ways on everyone else. Sen. Mike Azinger is a prime example of a delusional fool who rather than focus on lifting his constituents out of poverty in his state tells people to look to the imaginary figment in the sky to make things better. Sure, after all these years of praying, it hasn't helped one bit nor changed people.
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JaZe
All religions have a God by different names. Perhaps it should have been worded differently using 'divine being' or 'divine creator' or in our teachers we trust.
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Oaf Dawg
The Constitution says that there will be no official Federal religion, but left it up to the States to decide if they wanted a State religion. Nowhere in the Constitution will you see the words "separation of Church and State". There is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits religion in schools or other public institutions.
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Shango MasterExorcist, D.D.
One word should be added: "In god we Trust. Why?"
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Shango MasterExorcist, D.D. I agree. :Look at what's happened to American since we started using the phrase "In god we Trust" in 1956.
Sadly it is the official motto of the US. I think it's time we change it.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
This is a joke but politicians who are out of touch with the youth of America today. Young people don't have any faith or trust in God at all. A poster in a school isn't going to make someone trust in God. All they are going to do is make a mockery of it.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
Then again Douglas, it might make them pause, and think about it.
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Susan Colmenares
So might taking them to church. Then again, if churches became the refuges they once were instead of the big businesses they are now, maybe kids would want to go.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Susan Colmenares Kids today realize what a scam the Christian religion is. Christians are mean, controlling, do not treat women well, forgive pastors for rapping young women and molesting children. What young person wants to be a Christian when they might get rapped or molested?
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Ronaldo
False Christians are mean and controlling. The real Christians I know are kind, treat women well and, like our God, let people live their own lives, rather than being controlling. Besides, it was never pastors who did the "rapping". That was left up to the nun teachers and their rulers, rapping miscreants on their knuckles for misbehaving.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Ronaldo You must be blessed. I know of a lot of non-Christians who are just wonderful people and live and let live without hatred. It's the Christians and the ones who proclaim they are "Real Christians" who teach hate, are mean and are controlling of women.
Yes pastors are the ones who rape women and molest children so don't think it's just nuns and priests.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Carl Bernard Elfstrom I can see kids taking pause think about it. And realizing as they do today how "dope" (stupid) the posters is. I'm sure taggers will make a mockery of the posters as soon as they go up. Will it make a difference in a young child like? I would think so and that would be how stupid putting trust in a mythical God would be.
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Rev. Kev
First, if God is omnipresent and in the heart of every believer, how can God ever be taken out of schools? Does God require a motto to suddenly be present and do anything?
Second, as the article notes, what about the kids who have alternative or no religious beliefs? Isn't this a source of conflict or the government giving priority to one religion over the others?
Third, the article has a quote that the national motto was changed when America was at a tine of disunity. Nope. False. The motto was changed and added to currency (along with changing the pledge of allegiance) in response to the growth of communism. It was the government's way of saying, 'We are not like those godless reds. We were better than them.'
Basically, its activist Christians trying to sell their faith to others, whether they like it or not. Which I find wholly ineffective. If Christians want to sincerely show others the value of their faith then it should be through daily, consistent actions and words. Someone being kind and compassionate and patient every single day, no matter what, would impress me WAY more than hours and hours of preaching and Bible thumping. The former would make me wonder what they have going for them, and maybe even ask them about it. The latter would typically deter most people not already in the club.
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William R Clapie
Indeed. I grew up with this in school. We pledged to the American flag. I was among the students that took down and folded the school flag every day. I think it was respect irreguardless of religion, sexuality, color of skin, etc. Now adays we have people that are employed in many industries that openly disrespect the the flag and it's ideals. Yes, I used the common term "irreguardless" because it is an accepted version of the word.
Now, hum. Not so much. Yet all claim freedom under that flag. Hum. Anyone else see the problem here?
Yes, respect your religion, (race, there is only one and it's human) sexual creed, identity and many other items that I will not go into right now. If you look on tv, in the movies, in print for sakes. The minoritys of the country are taking over, again professing faith in freedom, yet, force their way into all media because they are underrepresented. Uh, sure. I grew up with Bill Cosby and the Cosby kids. Yeah, he is a bad example but there you have it. Under-represented, where?
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
I thought that was Fat Albert and the Cosby kids. Hay, hay, hay! Na,na,na we're gonna have a good time!
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Paul Edward Nunis
Also, in WWII, Christians who held to a literal interpretation of 'swear no oath', convinced the US Supreme Court to rule against mandatory performance of the Pledge in public schools.
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Bishop William Dusenberry, DD
As a ULC Bishop, with two DD’s, whose been sainted twice, and is also a SHP Celebrant (Secular Humanist Pantheist) and a FFRF Celebrant— In these capacities— it’s imperative — that all of us collectively — identify the specific God in whom we all are supposed to trust.
If this is assumedly an impossibility (coalesce around one generic god) and if we won’t all agree- that it’s the Christian God In whom we all agree to trust — then what are we ULC clergy persons collectively supposed to do?
We SHP'ers know that God and nature are the same thing — but personally I don’t trust nature some of the time; but most of the time I do, after all, whatever choice do I have?
So my vote would be to post (if there were to be any posts at all) “In the Christian God, most Christian West Virginians Trust - sometimes; but some other non-Christian West Virginians believe in non-Christian Gods, so be that as it may.”
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Dr. Zerpersande, NSC
As an avid golfer who once shot consistently in the 70s, an ex-employee of several chemical companies, the former CEO of the now defunct company ‘Wild Hog Teat Washer R Us’ and especially as active member of the AMA (Angry Militant Atheists) it is my opinion that any effort to define an agreed upon ‘god’ is not only silly but doomed to failure. It’s akin to trying to reach a consensus on the average length of a dragon’s penis or the average density of the last 4cm of the tips of unicorn horn.
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Shango MasterExorcist, D.D.
I Myself as a God who incarnates at this time as a ULC Bishop, with two DD’s, whose been sainted only once, and is also a Pantheist not limited by Secular Humanism I decree that one of the benefits of Godding is the faith that mortals have in us. It is somewhat orgasmic.
But too much of a good thing is boring for Gods, therefore we need to play pranks so that mortals lose their faith in us, and move on to choose another God.
I am sure that with TWO DD's like me, you actually know that the main point of being a god is that you are never specific! Mortals will never put their faith in anything specific.
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Maximillian Martin
Absolutely unconstitutional!!! Immediately pull any and all government funding or shut them down permanently!!! This country is NOT a theocracy and religion has NO place in public schools!!!
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Preacher Jim
MM, you are so right! Just look how well our education system, and the discipline there in, has been working since the ACLU and a few others, like you, worked so hard to expel God from school.
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Maximillian Martin
Others like me? Who would that be, oh ignorant one?? Your jew god doesn't help with discipline or the level of education kids get in schools. Their families play a far bigger part in that at home. What's next? Are people like you going to try to force your god or religion into homes? That would be a fatal mistake!!
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Paul Edward Nunis
Religion is one thing, corporate and corrupt churches, quite another. The former belongs in school as part of studying history, philosophy, literature, psychology, etc. The latter should be kept at home, and in privately funded schools.
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Daniel Gray
Sorry max but the US Supreme Court ruled 7-2 in the Newdow decisions that it IS constitutional and legal since it does not specifically mention any one Deity. meaning this is clearly your own OPINION and not based on anything but your beliefs.
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Giovanni T.Coleman
I'm very glad to see that being put back in the schools!! " IN GOD WE TRUST " Before it was taken out we never saw all this evil shootings and hatred.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Giovanni T.Coleman Why was there so much hatred and evil shootings in our country well before " IN GOD WE TRUST " was inserted into our schools. Hatred and evil shootings only continued to increase once " IN GOD WE TRUST " was in the schools. It's doubtful an " IN GOD WE TRUST " poster will reduce shootings or hatred. Education is what will get rid of hatred, not God.
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Mary
Your going to bring up school shootings then start enforcing the NO BULLY Zones and remove children from abusive households and the shootings will stop! Stop maybe I dunno since the NRA is handing them out like candy while they gaslight you!! Bullying is worse than parental neglect it is abuse! If you care about this you'll start researching and know what you are talking about. You can only abuse someone until you push them OFF the edge!
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Mary I agree there should be NO BULLY Zones but the problem is parents are the ones who teach and allow their children to be bullies. We already remove children from abusive households and have no place to put them. Jail/Juvenile Hall would just make things worse and turn them into harder criminals. Fat chance the shooting with stop with so many Americans/politicians in alignment with the NRA. Not sure if you know but the NRA was a "good" non-political organization for the first hundred years. Then there was a political coo at the annual meeting which turned the NRA into a highly political organization. Today's NRA is not the NRA the founding members hand in mind.
Between the NRA promoting the politics of gun ownership and 20 million "legal" gun sales every year the chances there are just too many guns in the hands of the public to every think shootings will decrease.
You are right about the bullying... Kids just can take the constant bullying. Police, courts, schools and parents are pretty much powerless to stop. This leaves the person getting bullied with very few options. One is suicided. Teen suicide over the past 18 years has dramatically increased. Another option for the bullied kid is to grab a gun and use it. And it's easier than ever for a kid to get a gun which is why we are seeing more kids shoot people. But young people shooting people are not just from bullying. There are religious groups who are teaching hatred and teaching young people how to shoot and kill Muslims, Jews, Blacks and Chinese. Just look at the number of shootings by young people Muslims, Jews, Blacks and Chinese since 9/11. And look at the number over the past 4 years. A lot of this is being driven by fake news as well as mis-, dis-information as well as flat out lies being told by our politicians. Sadly we are seeing way too many people being pushed OFF the edge. I suspect we will only continue to see more of this until our government stops all of their bickering and sets an example for the country.
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Maximillian Martin
It's unconstitutional. Bottom line. Religion doesn't belong in public schools!!!
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Joe Stutler
Sure, because posting a trite saying about a mythical critter solves everything. 🙄
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Clay Serenbetz
So in the Wild West, no one shot each other? When did this transformation happen? Before Hitler, before Al Capone, before the Civil War? I'd like to know when this fantasy land ceased to exist.
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Douglas Robert Spindler
@Clay Serenbetz And don't forget their were a lot less guns, and a lot less people. Every year the Americans legally buy 20 million guns.... This doesn't count for the guns that are illegally sold and stolen. We also have a very large population of mentally unstable people who have a legal right to purchase a gun. It's only becomes illegal for them to own it after they use it to kill people.
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Nicholas J Page
No child should be forced into religion nor should religion be forced into a child.Until they wish to know about God our holy spirit When they are old enough then let them study religion if they wish.
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Mary
Thank you!!
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Alun Lloyd Palmer
This should be a law suit. There again, this Supreme Court is so biased that there isn't anywhere it can be appealed to.
I say this world needs church now more than it ever did " YES PUT GOD IN CLASS and Everywhere that He can go.
We don't want government officials to put God anywhere. If they can put him in class they can put a different religion into class than yours. Parents should teach their children to worship along with the church to which they belong, not a public educator. The only way we remain free to practice our religion is to ensure everyone has the freedom to practice theirs. That means the government remains secular. Laws are there to ensure other's behaviors do not harm us. How we behave other than that is what choose to do based on our religion.
Besides, W. Virginia education has a lot more things to worry about than posters in the classroom. They are lagging behind. They need to pay more attention to the basics, not to forcing their religion onto everyone else.