fetus and scales of justice, depiction of legal battle over abortion
Evangelicals scored a major win in the legal battle of abortion recently.

The U.S. Supreme Court recently declined to hear a case challenging a new abortion law in Texas – basically allowing the provisions to go into law, and prompting intense new debate over an already-fraught subject. 

The Texas law bans abortion after a heartbeat is detectable in the fetus, which typically occurs around six weeks (before most women know they’re pregnant). Other controversial features of the bill include no exceptions for rape and incest, and a provision allowing private citizens to sue any practice or private individual who helps a woman obtain an abortion. It is effectively the strictest anti-abortion law in the United States.

Pro-choice activists were up in arms over the new law and the Supreme Court’s narrow decision. On the other side, pro-life groups and evangelicals – among the loudest voices pushing for such restrictions – were ecstatic.

“God Bless Texas!”

“God bless Texas!” tweeted Franklin Graham when the law went into effect at midnight on September 1st. 

Senate Bill 8 was signed into law by Texas Governor Greg Abbott in May of this year, and has seen legal challenge after legal challenge. Abortion providers and pro-choice groups fought tooth and nail to have it overturned, to no success.

Finally, in late August, Planned Parenthood filed an emergency appeal with the U.S. Supreme Court just days before the bill was to take effect, requesting that the nation’s highest court block the law. In a 5-4 decision, they declined to hear the case, leading to the now near-total abortion ban in the Lone Star State. It’s estimated the new law will prevent up to 85% of abortions in Texas.

Pro-life advocates in Texas were excited at the news, to say the least. CEO of Texans for Life Coalition Kyleen Wright said it is an “unimagined joy” to watch “Roe crumbling in front of our very eyes.”

As that quote indicates, anti-abortion advocates see this as another stepping stone to overturning Roe v. Wade, the landmark 1973 Supreme Court decision that codified the legal right to an abortion. And with the green light from the Supreme Court, other states have already signaled their intention to craft similarly restrictive laws.

Is It Un-American?

One Christian who isn’t thrilled about the new law? President and devout Catholic Joe Biden, who lambasted it as wildly unconstitutional:

"This extreme Texas law blatantly violates the constitutional right established under Roe v. Wade and upheld as precedent for nearly half a century. My administration is deeply committed to the constitutional right established in Roe v. Wade nearly five decades ago and will protect and defend that right."

As a Catholic, Biden is personally opposed to abortion, but is in favor of reproductive rights and doesn’t feel he has “the 'right to impose [his] view on the rest of society.'"

“I respect those who believe life begins at the moment of conception and all. I respect that, don’t agree, but I respect that,” said Biden, but he argues that the highly restrictive Texas law is “almost un-American.”

It's a view that has caused a serious rift between the President and his Church, as many Catholic faith leaders have sought to deny Biden communion over this stance on abortion. Some have even successfully carried out the threat

What do you think? How should Christians view this new law?

140 comments

  1. Alexander Clarke's Avatar Alexander Clarke

    Right wing Christians are the American Taliban.

    1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

      Well said. Both want control and dominance over women.

    2. Mary Catherine Kanz's Avatar Mary Catherine Kanz

      Exactly! And, yes, please secede from the Union. Please.

      1. Kathryn Darcy Smith's Avatar Kathryn Darcy Smith

        We would if we could! God Bless Texas!

    3. Robert A Stiff's Avatar Robert A Stiff

      Texas is the new US Caliphate.

    4. Rev Ned's Avatar Rev Ned

      Texan, Taliban. Both start with T. 🤔

  1. Maximillian Martin's Avatar Maximillian Martin

    More psychos telling people they don't even know what to do with their bodies!!! This has to stop!!!

    1. Robert Frizzell's Avatar Robert Frizzell

      Just curious, are you in favor of vaccine mandates?

      1. Nicole Carroll's Avatar Nicole Carroll

        We already have vaccine mandates. Polio, rubella, measles, mumps, etc. Why is this different?

        1. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

          True. most of which were used in an emergency classification before it was fully approved. Many of them were mandated long before we had a FDA to approve them but even those that came after, still given partial emergency approval just as this vaccine was. Now that the Pfizer formula is fully approve, and the medina is close to it, there shouldn't be an issue.

      2. Maximillian Martin's Avatar Maximillian Martin

        Not really. I think it's the choice of the individual. Just as an example, if they were to decide to mandate flu vaccines I would absolutely refuse it. I haven't had a flu shot in about 35 years and have had the flu 5 times or less in that time. Now with this current situation I still feel it should be a choice even though we don't know exactly how it will play out. Same thing with masks and quarantining people.

        1. Jean Bakula's Avatar Jean Bakula

          The people who aren't vaccinated are causing the break through cases of Covid. And the Southern states in the U.S. where the least are vaccinated have the most deaths, especially now of children. I guess somebody you know has to die of it before you will get it. Other vaccines are mandatory and have been. Do you want measles, mumps, rubella, polio, and all other diseases to come back too?

          We see how it's playing out. Again, mask less crowds spread the virus the most. I am glad for the mandates, if selfish people don't care who they kill. I bet you are pro life too, supporting a pro death platform.

          1. Lauren Irene Milian-Combs's Avatar Lauren Irene Milian-Combs

            I do not believe in the jab. And I do not believe in the flu shot. Its your business if you got the jab, everyone has a choice this is a fee country , not communist. The once that received the jab belong to Bill Gates he patented his vaccines, plus they kill people do your research. But you do not believe in Jesus either. God has said my people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge.

      3. Pink Clover's Avatar Pink Clover

        A woman being pregnant does not affect others. Not getting the vaccine can and does.

        THAT is the difference.

  1. Robert Edward Szekely's Avatar Robert Edward Szekely

    Maybe it is time Texas seceded from the Union, after all.

    1. Kathryn Darcy Smith's Avatar Kathryn Darcy Smith

      We would if we could! GOD BLESS TEXAS!

      1. Katelynne Shouse's Avatar Katelynne Shouse

        Don't let the door hit ya where mother nature split ya on your way out. BYE!

  1. Dan Anderson's Avatar Dan Anderson

    So when is Governor Abbott going to put a law into effect to demand all males get a vasectomy? Or will it be made illegal to obtain a vasectomy?

    1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      Abbott is another one this proud Texan never never voted for.

  1. Thom's Avatar Thom

    I will welcome my home, my couch, and assisted recovery to any women who choses to do what is her decision with her own body. No MAN or STATE has the right to tell an individual how to handle their medical decisions. We have crossed a very fine line with church and state that never should have been crossed!

    1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      Do you have good, free food at your house, Thom? And what about free booze? If so, please state your address. I know a lot of women who would take you up on that, and I'll come with them, to assist.

  1. William Diaz's Avatar William Diaz

    If God hates abortion, why does He allow miscarriages?

    William

    1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

      Texas prosecutors will need to go after God for killing fetuses with spontaneous abortions.

      1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

        That God is on the run, Douglas. So far us Texans haven't been able to catch him. But when we do, he knows he's got a good whipping coming to him.

    2. arawngraalrd's Avatar arawngraalrd

      If God or Nature is free to order a miscarriage, normally before Quickening, who should usurp that prerogative?

      1. William Diaz's Avatar William Diaz

        You used the word "If". which implies uncertainty. And you are juxtaposing "God and Nature" as if they are the same thing. Are they?

        William

    3. Dr. Bob Thomas's Avatar Dr. Bob Thomas

      A miscarriage is not an abortion. If abortion is murder, then yes it goes against God's commands.

      1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

        But god is a fictional entity, and to suggest your beliefs are more then personal an act of an insualr minded enemy of the secular U.S. society that all in the ULC must stand with to be in good standing and keep our minister status. Not one minister her supports the idea that any god or its commandments should dictate how society or even one person other then yourself should behave. We even firmly stand against indoctrinating your children and would call you pushing your faith on them an evil worthy of your destruction.

      2. William Diaz's Avatar William Diaz

        The effects on the body and the emotional impact are identical. Only the reason behind them differs. One is a choice by an individual the other caused by God. Both terminate a fetus! Miscarriages are sometimes referred to as spontaneous abortions.

        William

      3. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

        Unfortunately until the fetus is viable outside the womb then it isn't alive anyway, in which case its more a potential for life. If it isn't alive yet then it isn't considered murder. This is why they leaned on science to decide 22 weeks was the tipping point. At 6 weeks there is no heart, its a valve that won't become a heart for months. Top that with most women don't even know they are pregnant yet at that time and they have completely removed both personal choices for life as well as blocking women from options in caring for her own body. You cannot insist on less government oversite in peoples life and then over legislate for the exact opposite. The GOP has sunk to a new low.

    4. Cindy L Edgar's Avatar Cindy L Edgar

      Miscarriages are different than abortions

      1. William Diaz's Avatar William Diaz

        The effects on the body and the emotional impact are identical. Only the reason behind them differs. One is a choice by an individual the other caused by God. Both terminate a fetus! Miscarriages are sometimes referred to as spontaneous abortions.

        William

  1. Clay Serenbetz's Avatar Clay Serenbetz

    A bunch of men at the signed ceremony applauded when Abbot embarrassed himself by demonstrating his ignorance of women's reproductive health issues. First Abbott believes that you can arrest rapists before they commit a crime. He is unaware that most rapists are known to the victim. Also, he was unaware that women who have been raped will not know if they are pregnant or not within the six-week window allowed under the law. How any married man, with a daughter, be so clueless about a woman's reproductive health is stunning? How a Governor could sign a bill into law without knowledge of a woman's reproductive issues is grossly irresponsible and, in my view, criminal. His constituents need to remove Abbott from office and elect a responsible Governor who actually cares enough about an issue to educate themselves about the issue of which they support. Does this man have sex with his wife? Did he bother to consider his wife's body during her pregnancy. Does Abbott care about his daughter’s health. Apparently, he chooses to remain ignorant. I sympathize with his wife and daughter. Is Abbott senile and forgot his sex education? Oh, not all schools in Texas are required to offer sex education. Such education is not mandatory to graduate. Texas only teaches abstention in its sex education curriculum, which explains their high teen birth rate. This evidence proves that Texas fails to adequately educate its children. It's no wonder that they're living in the dark ages.

    1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      I understand Abbott had an accident and is paralyzed from the waist down. I wonder if that has figured into his decision.

      1. Clay Serenbetz's Avatar Clay Serenbetz

        His "accident" has absolutely nothing to do with his lack of judgment or his poor education or his political views. It may, however, affect his constituents' sympathy, which allows him to get away with murder.

  1. Katelynne Shouse's Avatar Katelynne Shouse

    If Texas won't leave of its own accord I say we kick it, and any other State that adopts these fascist and misogynistic laws, out on there butts......good riddance to bad rubbish

    1. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

      Yes, along with all misogynistic religions, which I'm thinking might be most of them. I'm good with that!

      🦁♥️

    2. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      It sounds like you're alright with all the laws of every other state, Katelynne. Are you sure you know what all of them are? I get every state has laws that some citizens dont agree with, so why not kick them all out of this nation. It might be better to accept that we can't always get what we want, but as law abiding, patriotic Americans, we go along with it anyway, and dont stir up any shit, that won't leàd to anything other than anxiety, and a headache.

      1. Katelynne Shouse's Avatar Katelynne Shouse

        You're absolutely correct I should not have singled Texas out when so many other States are just as misogynistic and anti-women. Therefore when reading my original post consider it to mean ALL STATES who act as Texas does should be kicked to the curb and left to fend for themselves. Thank you for pointing out my mistake!

    3. Kathryn Darcy Smith's Avatar Kathryn Darcy Smith

      We'd leave if we could! GOD BLESS TEXAS!

  1. William Dusenberry's Avatar William Dusenberry

    The next time you interact with anyone who would force a nine year old rape victim, who became pregnant, because she was raped by her father’s brother (her uncle) even though her MD told her parents, she’d probably die — during the birthing process;

    Tell such a compulsory pregnancy person, that it’s ok if he supports such a policy to use against his granddaughter — but question him about why he wants everyone else to do so — even if they consider such a policy to be medieval barbarism, reminiscent of the Spanish Inquisition.

    ULC Bishop William Dusenberry, DD.

  1. John Anderson's Avatar John Anderson

    The law won't STOP abortions in Texas, it will stop SAFE ones. It will return to the days before Roe v Wade, where an abortion clinic will use whatever is available to them (the old "coathanger" abortions) and charge an exorbitant fee to do so.

    1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      I've always been proud to be a Texan. It's our state politicians who need to be aborted. Or atleast tarred, feathered, and dragged behind a pickup truck! Dont put it past disgruntled Texans.

    2. Sergiy Kozulya's Avatar Sergiy Kozulya

      first, even so-called "safe" abortions sometimes lead to death or infertility. Secondly, this road can lead far. Step 1-legalizing abortions. Step 2-Legalizing prostitution (This is their choice! Safe sex is useful for the psyche of men! Let's create a union of prostitutes! Regular medical examinations!). Step 3-Legalization of ALL drugs ( Low-quality drugs kill people! Let's stop AIDS!). Step 4 - Legalizing murder (the world is suffering from overpopulation! You have the right to release your anger before it destroys your psyche). Step 5 - ? Perhaps you will agree with me - we need to stop somewhere on this road. And illegal clinics are now easy to track. And women after illegal "dangerous" abortions will immediately give the address and names.

      1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

        Murder is already legal, ever hear of war? I live in nevada so yeah am entirely pro legal prostitution, though I find it odd you think only women work the trade, and men are the only clients. Had a cousin that worked at the moonlight bunny ranch, and she said the vast majority of her clients were married couples and the husbands mainly watched.

        Oregon just decriminalized personal possession. States that have legalized pot have seen drastic reductions in resources wasted on locking up people for the "terrible crime" of getting themselves high.

        Abortions are legal, to make them illegal is to become a tool of evil. You are obviously evil so we all can see that fact in your posts.

        You also are clearly woefully ignorant of what anger does to a humans mind, nor do you have even close to an actual logical conclusion as killing is well documented to cause mental illness. Just as does the act of forcing a woman to carry a child to term.

        Just so you know more women die in the U.S. in childbirth annually then to botched abortions. So you basically invalidate yourself right out the gate. Which proves you are not just evil but woefully unfit to even step into the arena of reasoned human debate.

  1. Ruth Veale's Avatar Ruth Veale

    This is wrong on all levels. NOBODY has the right to tell a woman what she can and cannot do with her body, it doesn't belong to anyone but the woman and only she can decide what to do with it.

    It the woman doesn't to have children then it is her responsibility to take the necessary protection, it can't be left up to somebody else.

    Having said that, it is inhumane to expect a woman who has been raped by stranger or within the family or has been subjected to incest to be expected to carry a baby to term, this is beyond cruel and these should be exceptional cases.

    1. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

      In the very least add to that any pregnancy that isn't viable. There are a lot of invitro conditions where the fetus dies or will not survive at birth. Forcing a woman to carry that to term or until too sick to survive it is also wrong.

  1. Nicole Carroll's Avatar Nicole Carroll

    I don't understand why I see all these signs against the COVID vaccine stating clearly "MY BODY MY CHOICE!", but when it comes to abortion, it's a whole other mantra. I don't know too many people that are PRO abortion. I, and many others are not FOR abortion. I am FOR a woman's right to make her own very difficult choice. I'm PRO CHOICE! Get the difference?

    1. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

      Add to that a pregnancy isn't contagious. Covid is highly contagious and a serious concern for the public at large because we don't really know who can succumb and who can fight it off without a hitch. Being hypocritical about this doesn't help their cause. If they can control a single person's medical conditions that have no bearing on them then surely this highly contagious virus should be an even higher priority on their agendas since anyone can get it and pass it around.

  1. Herbert Moore's Avatar Herbert Moore

    I was hoping you might bring this to everyone's attention. It gives me an opportunity to invite the Wicca community to hex these Texas legislators - as some did Trump prior to 2020. Abortion issues aside - lopsided vigilante intimidation is wrong.

    1. Rev Mark D's Avatar Rev Mark D

      Herbie: Maybe you can answer, what exactly does Wicca religion have to do with abortion, either way? This is a new one on me.

      1. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

        I think you misunderstand. The call is for hexing legislators for getting involved. The GOP was 'supposed" to be about less government involvement in things and yet these yahoos keep pushing more legislation into controlling personal healthcare choices, who gets to vote, when and how, who gets educated and who doesn't... they need hexed back into some semblance of humanity and humility.

    2. arawngraalrd's Avatar arawngraalrd

      Throwing curses so casually is not something I'd encourage, but blessing Others to share in the Getting of Wisdom, is how I'd use The Rainbow Sword for Political Assassination.

  1. Rev Mark D's Avatar Rev Mark D

    Originally abortion was outlawed at the political action of doctors in the 19th Century, who were hacked off at losing business to midwives.

    1. Amber Fry's Avatar Amber Fry

      Partly. Either way it was made legal again because women were getting them anyway by backstreet butchers. Infection and death was often the result. So was infertility if they survived. It couldn't be regulated so it was made legal again to save lives and keep the procedures in check. It's about to happen again if this law takes hold. So much for pro life. Take the side of the potential over the actual living and the world suffers far more than it should have to.

  1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

    A man forcefully raping a women is less of a crime in Texas than a women getting an abortion.

  1. Nicolas Zart's Avatar Nicolas Zart

    I always find it fascinating that these Earthly laws are usually heralded by men. If men could get pregnant and even raped, would they still feel the same?

    1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      Thank you for posting this. I certainly wouldn't mind if you posted this again and in capital letters. This really needs to be said over and over. Maybe these men need to wear those electronic labor simulators to even experience the pain of childbirth. Men that have tried these have had their eyes opened and found a new respect for women.

      I find it sad that men that are ministers (here on this site) feel the need to comment with such ignorant and inhumane views. A minister should not hold nasty comments such as a woman needs to keep it to her self, get a coat hanger and someone to help and go sit over a toliet. And the fact that they all suggest that it is okay for the rape and incest victim to be forced to have the baby...

      Now, they are looking at banning the morning after (abortion) pill...Where will it end??

  1. P. Keith Benefiel's Avatar P. Keith Benefiel

    Ex Senator from Wyoming, Alan Simpson was right. Men should have no vote on the subject. I believe that restricting a woman's right to make decisions about her own body violates Amendments 1,4,8,9,10 and 13 of the Constitution. Free universal birth control for all would be a help. Cheers

  1. Dr. Bob Thomas's Avatar Dr. Bob Thomas

    I read: Psalm 139:13-16 NASBS For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother's womb. [14] I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. [15] My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth; [16] Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them.

    This tells me that at conception, it is not just a collection of cells that have come together. It is a life, and it is in the process of being created. To me, this tells me that The Lord is involved with every moment of my life starting at conception and continuing to my final judgement.

    Hebrews 9:27 NASBS And inasmuch as it is appointed for men to die once and after this comes judgment,

    I am very concerned with the incredibly large number of abortions done in this country every year.

    I am confused when a person is charged with two counts of murder if a pregnant woman is killed along with her unborn child. In this instance, the court sees two deaths. The pregnant woman, and the unborn child. However, that same court sees no murder if only the unborn child dies. That makes no sense to me.

    The large number of abortions does not come close to the number of reported rapes that lead to conception. The same is true with incest. Even when the two are combined, still that count is well beneath the number of abortions that take place.

    I understand the position of the woman who was raped. Either by a stranger or a family member. I cannot condone murder to be justified by it.

    For me, this law is a step in the right direction.

    The next step, I think, should then be to take the funding for the abortion clinics and put it toward helping to pay for the birth of the unwanted child, and counseling for the mother, as well as care for that child as it grows. Direct it towards social programs that help to pay for education, healthcare, childcare, and whatever else is necessary to help both the mother and the child have the best possible life that they can. Jesus told us that we will always have the poor with us. We are also commanded to love each other as we love God. So let's finally show that. From the start to the finish. And perhaps, just maybe, the rapes, the incest, the unwanted births will decrease. Add to all that prayer and perhaps they will vanish completely. It would certainly be worth trying. We have to do a better job of caring for each other. We have nothing to loose and everything to gain. Let it start here.

    1. Thom's Avatar Thom

      Then Dr. Bob I ask you, are you ready to adopt every single child of which is born due to this law and take financial responsibility for them. Because your political party refuses to fund the Government agencies where these children tend to end up. So I ask, are you prepared to adopt many?

      1. Dr. Bob Thomas's Avatar Dr. Bob Thomas

        No, not every single one. I will do my share. Let's go together and we both can do this. I do not mind adopting another child. I will make room at my table.

        1. Minister Wilson's Avatar Minister Wilson

          Greetings Dr. Thomas,

          I do understand your confusion and if I may, murder is defined as “the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another”. Irrespective of the number of abortions, it has been decided that “women” have the right to choose whether or not they want to remain pregnant. Although you may feel that abortion is murder, abortion is legal; therefore, the procedure is not unlawful. In other words, a person has the legal right to do what some consider morally wrong (Leif, 2021).

          If you and your significant other do not believe that abortion is right for you, please refrain from getting one. I am also concerned that the states that infringe on these rights seem to have no moral integrity when that child becomes an adult that commits a crime and is put to death. If we were to apply your reasoning, then this would also constitute “murder”. You have your opinion that you wish to be respected, then we must also respect other’s choices as well. People have the right to act as immorally as the law allows; it is not suitable for us to force them to do otherwise, provided their choice does not harm others. Please, before claiming that abortion harms a child, a zygote, fetus, or embryo is yet to be a child, and a person’s autonomy or rights should not be contingent on their physical status.

          I appreciate the goodwill you have expressed and something to consider; if God has made the world as you claim, then it must be already perfect the way it is currently. I respect your opinion; however, the new Texas law is a complete subjugation of a women’s right to choose what is best for her, so it is the wrong direction.

          Take care,

          Leif, W. (2021, February 18). Rights. Retrieved from Stanford encyclopedia of philosophy: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/rights/

          1. Nicole Carroll's Avatar Nicole Carroll

            Thank you Minister. Perfectly said.

      2. Woodrow's Avatar Woodrow

        Thom, then you are ready to kill every single child. So I ask, are you prepared to kill every child and use their DNA to make more vaccines and drugs.

    2. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

      First of all there are already far too many humans on this planet. We are fast approaching 9 billion. Unless you actually yearn for a future in which the entire human race is packed together the way they are in Tokyo, you may want to rethink your view on uncontrolled proliferation of our species.

      Second of all, the fact you are too lacking in folds in the brain to understand why a woman has autonomy of her body, and that unless she deems it so, a fetus actually qualifies as a parasite. You seem to suggest you have an insular view of faith traditions, that means you can not be a minister in good standing here, we are a secular based ministry and as such any suggestion that your personal faith and beliefs should hold sway over others identifies you as someone who is actual evil.

      Understand this now and never forget it, if you think forcing a victim of rape to carry the product of that rape to term is an act of actual evil. In The U.S. we hold personal liberty as sacred above all faith systems. You seek to enslave women and as such are an enemy of every true citizen of the U.S. and deserve the same fate as any who threaten the liberty of even one citizen of this nation.

    3. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

      How does anyone know what Jesus truly said being as all we have is here-say, written decades after the said event, by someone that we have very little evidence ever existed?

      Might it really have been Brian that said anything? Perhaps Monty Python was right after all.

      Let’s also not follow the mythical Christian god if we are looking for good examples on how not to save babies lives.

      🦁❤️

      1. Chaplain Shawn's Avatar Chaplain Shawn

        Greetings Blessed One Dr. Lionheart, SBS (Supreme Biblical Scholar)

        The reply works for you and Dr. Terikson who also holds a SBS. You both present yourselves as knowledgeable authorities on theism. However, the late Dr. Paul Kurtz wholeheartedly disagrees with you both. What is Secular Humanism? written by Kurtz in 2007 or 2008 states that Secular Humanists do not believe in God, Jesus, The Holy Spirit, angels, the metaphysical, and the paranormal. God is incomprehensible and unintelligible. So why does Lionheart and Terikson mention religion at all? Why does Terikson posit ULC is a secular based ministry when in reality anything secular holds there is no God or gods? I see many contradictions in the worldview of Secular Humanism. Seems you do not want theism as it is, but it is ok to have a secular ministry, hilarious. ULC is secular because they will take $29.95 or whatever price so you can pay for an unqualified ordination with credentials and parking pass discounts, and other VIP benefits. What a joke, and what a sham. The secular keep redefining themselves, contradict the founding SBS Dr. Kurtz, and now want to appear to be a ministry, wow. Your ministry has no biblical basis and would result in many lives lost all over the world when the caliphate is implemented. Consider this, Biden and Pentagon ranking officials have stated they may cooperate with the Taliban in the future. Perhaps, both of your trolling and snarky asides are lacking substance. The secular hold fast to education and science to explain things. Not everyone shares your views. Maybe Atheism, secular humanism, and etc. need to replaced with commonsense.

        Terikson, SBS referring to a fetus as a parasite, really? Your view on human life is reprehensible. As long as young people in their prime exist on the planet, babies will be born. It is a fact of your secular world. I also believe women have the right to do with their body as they please. When you allow that to occur you separate those in the way of Cain, the worldly, from those in the light of the Spirit. Remember if a fetus is a parasite, then all humans, babies on up, started as a parasite including you, Lionheart, and everyone of us. Maybe the human race needs to become extinct for the pests and cockroaches we are. If you can say we are parasites Terikson, SBS; then I can say we are cockroaches. Lol! Have a nice day cockeroaches! Extinction is nigh!

        Not Respectfully,

        Sean the Apologist (Your friendly neighborhood apologist, MA Apologetics)

        1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

          Oh man it is hilarious you call yourself an apologist. Real followers of the Christ like Ray Comfort or C.S. Lewis both of whom are world renowned for their abilities in the arena of Christian Apologetics. Both have also in their various writings pointed out that you can not argue from an unprovable position, that means even a real apologist does not argue from the position that their beliefs in something intangible may not be used as if they are substantial or have actual validity.

          You also clearly are ignorant of what the word parasite means. A parasite can be anything that drains from another life form and is unwanted. unlike a symbiosis which is what a fetus that wanted becomes. As then the positive emotional experience of impending motherhood is something being given for the price of the resources the fetus takes from the body. It is like you cant understand that something is defined by what it does. A fetus that is unwanted and is causing stress as well taking resources from the body is not the same thing. Just as a human who as you have done self dehumanizes by failing to conduct oneself based on the ancient art of debate by failing to accept that your belief is only important to you, and you try to push what amounts to your beliefs upon other, an act of evil that would warrant your destruction in any sane and civil society.

        2. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

          Thank you Sean. I don’t see how the late “Dr. Paul Kurtz disagrees with me” if he’s dead, unless of course he is somehow paranormally conferring with you. Please let us know.

          You might be right that secularists don’t believe in any gods, angels, fairies, gnomes, elves, unicorns, tooth fairies, Santa Clause etc., and this is mainly due to the overwhelming lack of any evidence, unless of course you can demonstrably provide any. It would in fact be very nice if you could, especially the god myth. I’m really hoping that a god is real because I seriously want to meet it and poke it in its eye, and stamp on its sandalled feet if I ever see it for its major lack in morals for humanity.

          Thank you for your epistle. I am in fact respectful of everyone, apart from Traitor Joe, leaving people and equipment behind in Afghanistan, and failing to save lives of our Military. Has he checked his watch lately?

          Respectfully 🦁❤️

          Respectfully

    4. Clay Serenbetz's Avatar Clay Serenbetz

      You should know that the Texas law does not have an exception for rape or incest. In quoting Psalms are you arguing that your God condones rape and incest? Texas is notorious for valuing every life, but once born, Gov. Greg Abbott tells us that “no freedom is more precious than life itself.” Under Abbott, Texas has the highest percentage of people with no health insurance and ranks high in the number of teen births. Don’t look for any help from the the Texas government, unless you are a company asking for tax abatements. If Texas cared about human life, then the legislature would have beefed up its social programs concurrent with this law. The failure to do so belies their feigned interest inprotecting life. Texas ranks poorly in the percentage of residents in poverty … If Abbott really cared about every one of us, wouldn’t he do everything possible to improve these numbers?

    5. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

      Dr. Bob the Bible also says, "There she lusted after her lovers, whose genitals were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of horses.:" Ezekiel 23:20.

      God says women should be allowed to enjoy sex.

      1. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'do spin': Give me the specific Biblical reference that justifies your last paragraph.

        1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

          The husband should fulfill his wife’s sexual needs.

          ~ 1 Corinthians 7:3

          1. flugo's Avatar flugo

            'do spin': Sorry! Not a hint of 'enjoyment' in your reference.

            1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

              Appears you do not know or understand what the sexual needs of a women are. Do you know even know how to pleasure a women? Matthew 5:28 Try taking your head out of your bible and read a book on women's anatomy and sexual desires. Ephesians 4:14–16; Romans 12:1–2 Some of the best sex I have had is with Christian women. This is because Christian men try to control and repress the sexual needs of women. It's a lot of fun to release all of that sexual tension women have, Ezekiel 23:20. Sad you are missing out on it.

              1. flugo's Avatar flugo

                'do spin': Sorry. Again, you fail miserably to reply to my above request. I didn't ask for your experiences, your opinions, your inane blather. I just want the specific Biblical references as requested.

              2. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

                flugo Dude I've cited the Bible versus.

      2. Dr. Bob Thomas's Avatar Dr. Bob Thomas

        Ezekiel 20 speaks of two nations as if they were two women. This chapter describes the spiritual infidelity of Israel and Judah, pictured as two sisters, to convey the gravity of sin in Judah. “One mother” refers to the united kingdom, while “two women” refers to the divided kingdom. Oholah, meaning “Her own tabernacle,” as she had her separate dwelling-place apart from the temple, represents Samaria. In the northern kingdom, Jeroboam had set up worship, which God rejected. Oholibah, “My tabernacle is in her,” represents Jerusalem, where God did establish worship. Context is important.

        As to 1 Corinthians 7:3, here again you ignore the context. There is a great danger of sexual sin when single (cf. Mt 19:12). Marriage is God’s only provision for sexual fulfillment. Marriage should not be reduced simply to that, however. Paul has a much higher view and articulates it in Eph 5:22, 23. He is, here, stressing the issue of sexual sin for people who are single.

        1. Douglas Robert Spindler's Avatar Douglas Robert Spindler

          Dr. Bob Thomas, It all depends on how you read and interpret the words of the Bible. How do you know they are two sisters? How do you know they were women? I have yet to find in the Bible or for that matter any pastor who can tell me what the characteristics or a man and a women are. What do you call a person who has developed breasts, overlies and testicles? Is that a man or a women? Young people today realize the Bible is so out of touch with reality they are turning away from religion. With 1 out of every 200 births resulting in a sexual abnormality one would think God and the Bible would talk about gender differences, but it doesn't. In young people's minds this just proves the Bible was written by men which were not inspired by God.

          Dr. Bob what's your definition of a women?

  1. Cheryl Anne Hamm's Avatar Cheryl Anne Hamm

    Separation of church and state is under attack. God gave us free will to make our own decisions for which we will have to answer, not to man but to God. Morality cannot be legislated. Its ironic that the church claiming to follow the teachings of the Christian God that wants to take control of every aspect of our lives.

    1. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

      Yes, and what does the mythical Christian god know about morality, obviously nothing, judging from his poor decisions of genocide and infanticide.

      🦁♥️

  1. Daniel Gray's Avatar Daniel Gray

    Makes no difference if you like the law or not, the law is the law and has been ruled so by SCOTUS when the five of them said that Planned parenthood could not appeal or sue as they are not able to show they have been "harmed" in any way, and as such under the legal and constitutional decision, they have absolutely NO legal standing, meaning they cant sue no matter what. It would take someone who can PROVE that they have been harmed by this law, and if they could prove that then they already would have had someone front and center.

    Now if this ticks you off, then what are you going to do in the next term of SCOTUS when they rule on the Mississippi law that bans abortions after the 15th week.

    1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

      Well the Church of Satan is already one step ahead, they have it in their legally protected faith doctrine that the right to abortion is a sacred thing for women, and as such under texas law that protects ones faith based rights above all else, it just means anyone in need has to go to an actual satanic abortion ceremony. Which is so awesome now I wish I was a woman able to get preggers just so I could go attend an actual satanic abortion.

      Hail SATAN! throws the horns

      1. Daniel Gray's Avatar Daniel Gray

        Sorry Turkey, but NO court in the world is going to allow a religion to claim that abortion is part of their church when they never had or claimed it before. so this is going to be laughed out of court and dismissed with prejudice when a judge with any brains sits down to hear it.

      2. Maximillian Martin's Avatar Maximillian Martin

        You need to learn the difference between the Church Of Satan and The Satanic Temple. The Satanic Temple is the one involved in the legal battle against Texas, not the Church Of Satan.

  1. David Arthur Lewis's Avatar David Arthur Lewis

    Have you accepted Donald Trump as your personal Lord and Savior?

    1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      If you support Donald Trump..you support racism, narcissim, ignorance, facism...and a person that is less than human..less than an ameoba. Trump is the slime on the bottom of your shoe. He revels in cheating people out of their money, of making the most nastiest petty comments around. He threatens and bullies. He revels in conning his people to do his bidding for him so his tiny hands look "clean". He pushes and tells people to do things and when things come crashing down he is no where to be seen. The man is not compassionate, not remorseful, could never be self aware. He is the most selfish thing around.

      A person who has integrity and lives by good values would never be able to vote for someone like Trump. NEVER!

      1. Takaya Kovani Sweeney's Avatar Takaya Kovani Sweeney

        Well said.

    2. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

      Damn! If it's choice between Donald, or Traitor Joe, I have to go with Donald. 🤷🏻‍♂️

      🦁♥️

      1. David Arthur Lewis's Avatar David Arthur Lewis

        Yeah, I figured you were one of his minions. So how's the weather in Moscow?

        1. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

          It’s not too bad. Thanks for asking comrade. I’m glad we are making Joe see sense in insisting for mandates whether the people like it or not. The sooner people start towing the line and doing as they’re told by Joe the better 🤪

          Ready for Donald back yet?

          🦁❤️

          1. David Arthur Lewis's Avatar David Arthur Lewis

            No, sorry. Your Personal Lord and Savior Donald J (for Jesus) Trump, the Father of Lies and Grabber of Genitalia, can go back to his home in Hell. And, by the way, Trumpty Dumpty got his shots.

            1. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

              I’d rather have Donald making the nation profitable than your sniffer of young human beings that needs a teleprompter to read his script, prepared by others, taking us into massive debt.

              🦁❤️

              1. Takaya Kovani Sweeney's Avatar Takaya Kovani Sweeney

                I’d rather go into debt to help the working and middle class than to continue transferring our tax dollars into the hands of the pentagon, the greedy rich and corporations.

                I don’t care who’s president.

              2. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

                I hear you Takaya. In many ways I feel the same way. We now even have a bar room girl as a representative who couldn't even afford a rusty Yugo car a couple of years ago, now driving a Tesla, and cavorting, like a bar room girl, wearing a white dress with "Tax The Rich" on it. I don't understand how the Hollywood crowd, and politicians, don't realize they are the rich. Perhaps they are now the untouchables.🤷🏻‍♂️

                🦁♥️

  1. Ingrid Magnusson's Avatar Ingrid Magnusson

    Women still have six weeks to abort. The abortion pill is available. It’s not rocket science. Any woman who has had sex and doesn’t want the responsibility has a month and a half to deal with it. So why would they want to wait until the baby is formed to kill it? That’s what annoys me. Why wait until it’s a formed human being to kill it when they have six whole weeks to fix their ‘problem’. It’s just laziness.

    1. Nicole Carroll's Avatar Nicole Carroll

      You are a woman? Do you get your period? If the answer is yes to both questions, please re-educate yourself on the cylcle of a woman. If you get your period every 4- 5 weeks, and you are late, BAM, your 6 week window has passed. In addition, why do people always assume women are just having sex left and right, getting pregnant and aborting. There are soooo many medical reasons why.

    2. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      Apparently, since the Texas law passed the Republicans are looking at making the morning after pill illegal. Just imagine that ...back to coat hangers or finding the money to go to a different state.... It is not laziness. I didn't know I was pregnant til after 6 weeks. However, I have a medical condition. I have epilepsy. I have 1 child already...he is on the Autism Spectrum. Apparently my medications are extremely harmful to the development of a child. The doctor said if you get pregnant again...your child could be born without all his/her limbs and possibly have other significant health issues. And so when I realized I was pregnant after 6 weeks I got an abortion. Because I didn't have the money or the energy to take care of another special needs child. And before you go off thinking I wasn't using protection...I was. Except that I can't take the pill and condoms are not 100% effective.

    3. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

      The fact you refer to it as killing a baby invalidates you entirely. Until you alt reich zealots can argue from the position of reality, and not you emotional based authoritarian mythology you do not have a valid position and have in fact self dehumanized by the traditions of human debate going back before the time of your false god.

      The fact you you show such ignorance about a womans body and biology, and ignore the entire issue of personal autonomy further outs you as someone who has no place among civil society.

  1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

    All I have to say is this: the only man that should even perhaps have any say in this would be the man that got the woman pregnant. I am sick to death that all you men talk about something you don't even know about. Let's just make the woman that was violently raped at knife or gun point and have her carry her baby to term. Oh, that won't hurt her...therapy will make it right. Surely, it was God's will that she was raped and got pregnant and it is God's will she has to have the baby. And so while she goes to therapy if she can get it for free...she will hate her child most likely because the child will be the physical end result of the perhaps one of the most painful in her life. And who cares about her age or her financial status...she will just have to have that baby. And maybe the rapist has some sort of genetic marker for something such as Down's syndrome or MS or something else. So now the baby will have massive health issues possibly even be born without a certain limb. And the woman now has to care for a child who has special needs. Maybe the rapist was a drug addict as well and so now her baby when it is born will have to be in the ICU. Don't tell me this stuff doesn't exist. I wasn't on drugs and neither was my boyfriend. However, I have medical conditions that require heavy medications which can harm the development of the child. My doctor told me I was lucky that my son was born with all of his limbs. However, he did end up on the Autism Spectrum. It was tough . I was 19 and I was married. When I got pregnant the second time he said it was my choice but the doctor reminded me again about the extremely high likelihood my child will have extreme health issues. I didn't know I was pregnant til after 6 weeks. And I got the abortion. And while I was sad...I realize I didn't have the energy or the financial means to raise 2 kids with extreme health issues. I made the best decision possible for me and my potential baby. Cause I do not believe a baby exists at conception. Once again though..everywhere and on this site unless you are a doctor, a spouse, etc that is a man you do not know what you are talking about.

    1. Joy 's Avatar Joy

      Thank you for sharing with us. You are so very correct. Most do not understand, even some women don't even understand. I commend you on making the right choice for you and your family.

      1. Robert A Stiff's Avatar Robert A Stiff

        Halleluiah! Men need to butt out of any legislation that pertains exclusively to women.

    2. Jean Bakula's Avatar Jean Bakula

      And people who insist this draconian law is good, only care about the fetus while it's in the womb. They never support any programs to help Mothers. Many women have boyfriends who bolt the minute she finds she's pregnant, often from birth control that failed. I'm sorry you had such a hard time, but would have done the same.

  1. James Thomas Mackay's Avatar James Thomas Mackay

    I'm overjoyed that Gov. Abbott and the legislators in TX had the "guts" to pass this law. It's been long overdue. Roe v. Wade was erroneously passed in the first place. How can a law "permit" human destruction? No one in their right mind can deny that their so-called fetus is actually a human embryo? Over 63 million children have been murdered since 1973. It's time to accept the fact that only God has the right to take a life (except in warfare). Thank you Lord and I look forward to other States exploring a similar law. Jim in Silver Spring, MD.

    1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

      To even suggest your god is real is an act that would allow another of a differing faith in the U.S. to invoke stand their ground against you as anyone espousing insular rhetoric is expressing an attitude a sane and civil minded citizen in the U.S. may take your life for as you are clearly a threat to the life and liberty of actual humans.

      Never forget if you can not accept your idea of god is personal and has no authority over any but yourself, you have no standing in these forums. Only secular ministers of the ULC in good standing have any validity here.

  1. arawngraalrd's Avatar arawngraalrd

    Abortion Law, pro and con, has always been about protecting the Medical Monopoly. Texas now has a state law, where states have a duty to legislate, and those who don't like it can go back to California.

  1. Cindy L Edgar's Avatar Cindy L Edgar

    I think it's about time they banned abortions the only one that should have abortions are the women who have been raped or it's a life-and-death situation besides. No nobody should have been allowed to oops I got pregnant and I'm going to go have an abortion no those aren't right if you lay down and have sex with somebody and you got pregnant well that's your fault and the other person's fault nobody else's and that little life should not have to suffer because you made a mistake

    1. Joy 's Avatar Joy

      So how about educating young boys to be gentlemen, showing them women are not property? How about educating young men about birth control? How about teaching men and boys that it is not OK to hit a woman, or force them into sex? How about teaching real sex ed in schools for both boys and girls, instead of teaching this puritanical purity virgin sex stuff? How about we stop shaming women for enjoying sex?

      Why does everything single thing get put on the shoulders of the woman? Your are not looking at the big picture.

      "If you lay down and have sex with somebody and you got pregnant...." what about the man in the situation? I don't know if you realize this but it takes two to make a baby. And we continue to shame and blame the woman if she gets pregnant? When do the men get held accountable?

      Oh, that's right. They can't in an Abbot State because they want the "Handmaid's Tale". They want control plain and simple. That is the real heart of the issue. Not abortion. It's about control. And you are playing right into the scenario. It's not going to stop at abortion. It never does.

    2. Clay Serenbetz's Avatar Clay Serenbetz

      You forgot that the Texas law has no exceptions for rape and limits medically necessary Abortions.

  1. Sergiy Kozulya's Avatar Sergiy Kozulya

    A good law. 6 weeks is enough time to make a decision. A normal woman will worry a week after a delay in menstruation. The tests allow her to determine pregnancy at a period of about 2 weeks.

    1. arawngraalrd's Avatar arawngraalrd

      Quickening begins about six weeks after Conception, and a woman will have missed two periods. It would help if Panned Parenthood would stop telling Children that Condoms and Oral Contraceptives are 100% effective.

      1. Sergiy Kozulya's Avatar Sergiy Kozulya

        100% efficiency is provided only by irreversible operations. Therefore, we have to live with what we have. And buy test systems if the cycle is broken....

    2. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

      You are insane and frankly obvious ignorant of how the body of a woman works. Periods are far from clockwork especially in women going through puberty( which fyi actually goes on in humans until we are in are mid 20s) It is well known among the medical community that 6 weeks is entirely too little a time by any reasonable standard. And again any law against abortion is inherently evil. Wanting to push your moral ideal based on a faith tradition begun by incestuous child raping goat herders thousands of years ago who literally made it up stealing the names of 2 gods from the major civilizations of the area and smashing them together and saying they are the true chosen people of this true god makes you beyond evil. Like Hitler and Stalin are genuine humanitarians compared to people like you.

      1. Sergiy Kozulya's Avatar Sergiy Kozulya

        Before accusing someone of insanity, check yourself with a psychiatrist.

        1. Ilmenheru Terikson's Avatar Ilmenheru Terikson

          Thank you for further self dehumanizing. Until you learn how to write a coherent statement and construct an actual argument you do not have any substance and are just another invalid non human.

  1. Lord Morgan's Avatar Lord Morgan

    The enemy of my enemy is my enemy, The friend of my friends of my friend and Lord, are my friends.

    I am Valyrian/Valhalla, I am in this War, with Lore and Gore. Its an Evolutionary Tale of Lore.

    1. David Arthur Lewis's Avatar David Arthur Lewis

      Off your meds again, Morgan?

    2. Lionheart's Avatar Lionheart

      Your post is one of the weirdest things I have ever read here. Whatever it means, thank you for making me smile.

      Be well

      🦁❤️

    3. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      Please tell us Morgan, in your current delusion, do you think you're a member of the British House Of Lords? Tally ho, and away we go!

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    Why do women who want abortions have to tell anyone about it? Why can't they do it in private? I've heard all it takes is a wire clothes hanger, an assistant, and a working toilet. Legal or not, nobody else has to know about it, unless they're co-dependant self-defeatists.

    1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      I hope this comment was sarcastic and not a real serious comment. Because if it is WTF?? You are a cruel person...not even a person. You would want your wife, daughter, sister, or aunt have to do this??? You would tell them to shut up and get a coat hanger and shove it in her to do the abortion??? Would you tell them carry the baby that is the end result of a rapist who raped any of them at knife or gunpoint?? Wouldn't you want them to get the best possible care. You views are disgusting and I am offended and I am sure others here are. I do not believe you are fit to be a minister. Someone like you advising women during an emotional time in their lives...

    2. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      WTF??? Are you being sarcastic? Because if this is a serious comment I am extremely offended and so would many people even men. So, I am just supposed to be treated like an animal. Grab a clothes and dig that thing up my vagina to my womb??? Yes, I agree with you don't need to tell everyone about it, however, sometimes people need support and need to talk with someone. So, do you have a wife, sister, daughter, aunt, grandmother etc? Would you like to see them raped and then tell them just shut up and get a coat hanger and take care of it??? If this is a real true comment then you are not a true minister. No one who is a minister should ever take this approach. In fact, I would go so far as to say you are not a human being. This is beyond cruel. You need help.

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    Morgan, I see uggest you contact your psychiatrist. You sound like it might be a good time for a medication change.

    1. Robert A Stiff's Avatar Robert A Stiff

      Carl Bernard Elfstrom: anyone ever tell you that your like the classic school yard bully...calling names, mocking and disparaging any and everyone who might offer an opinion that doesn't match your self-entitled rants? You're such a cliché.

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    Ehrman, everywhere you go life is also full of foolishness. You better try reading between the lines, and quit being so damn gullible!

  1. William Dusenberry's Avatar William Dusenberry

    Every ULC’er, should try using the word “nature” in place of “God” any time they even consider using the word “God.”

    Thomas Jefferson (a Pantheist, as was Albert Einstein) used “Nature’s God” In his Declaration of Independence, and saying “Nature’s taking care of you” — anytime someone sneezes, is a great conversation starter.

    I used to say “thanks for not sneezing on me” but my wife says that doing so is impolite.

    “In Nature we Trust” — what other choice do we have?” Should be our national motto.

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    William, this isn't a goddam A.A. meeting! You're completely off the subject. We're not going to talk about money! This article is about abortions. Did you forget? Snap back to reality, man!

    1. Sharon Veronica Meixsell's Avatar Sharon Veronica Meixsell

      Money is about abortion. Because making a woman have to have a child means she needs to have the money to raise it. And if she was pregnant because of rape or incest and is extremely young she will not have the means. Also, some health insurers will cover a percentage of an abortion. The rest is paid for by the patient having the abortion. So yes, money does come into the discussion.

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    So, if you didn't compare yourself with others Ehrman, what did you compare yourself with, a toad perhaps. Considering some of your redundant babblings in the Desiderata, that you've convinced the ULC holds the answers to all my perceived problems, I wouldn't be surprised.

  1. Cathi Fleet Robinson's Avatar Cathi Fleet Robinson

    Many of these pro birth comments are outrageous and misinformed. Pro life is definitely not pro life. Religious interpretations are varied. Science teaches us factually. To be pro life is really to be pro choice- no wiggle room to think otherwise. Abortion is much needed healthcare and our personal agreement or disagreement is meaningless in a decision that each person makes in their healthcare. We must advocate against this restrictive Texas law as well as any other state that follows. Research extensively the facts prior to legalized and safe abortion procedures were available. It’s ludicrous to speak in favor of this Texas law without understanding the very real consequences- pro life is not the same as pro birth and it is dangerously and irresponsibly to think otherwise.

  1. Ronaldo's Avatar Ronaldo

    The matter of abortion, and when the fetus becomes a separate life, should not be a political or a religious matter. This is a medical issue, and we should be demanding that our medical community, using all the resources at their disposal, actually make that determination. While God told Jeremiah that He knew him before he was formed in the womb, God was talking to a prophet, and we have no indication in Scripture that the same rule applies to those who were not chosen as prophets. Some say it's a woman's body, and she has every right to do whatever she wants to with it, but that should not apply if the fetus is a separate life, as it is not the woman's body any longer. Some state supreme courts have ruled that a woman can, and has been, convicted of child abuse because she did drugs while pregnant. If she can be convicted of child abuse, then the court is tacitly recognizing the fetus as a child.

  1. George Oliver Hutson's Avatar George Oliver Hutson

    I wonder what is the opinion of Universal "Life" church. Do the people who run the ministry believe that abortion is the woman's right? I know far too many women who have chosen abortion because a baby would inconvenience them. Abortion was just another form of birth control. The problem is they should have thought about the repercussions of their actions before giving in to lust. I believe life begins at conception...what say you Universal Life Church?

    1. Joy 's Avatar Joy

      Oh so it's the woman's fault for getting pregnant? What about the man? When will we hold these "lustful and sinful" men accountable?

    2. Jean Bakula's Avatar Jean Bakula

      The men rarely spend a whole day with their children in all the kid's lives in families that conservative. It's "Women's Work." She never has time to go to school, get a career, have a life. And why aren't there more kinds of birth control for men? Why don't you take responsibility for a change? There's little research on it because men don't want to be bothered.

  1. James Philip Reader's Avatar James Philip Reader

    So, not going to enter the fray over abortion - I'm pro-choice and the issue is unresolvable since neither side is going to change their opinions. I will however take issue with sentiments paraphrased as "maybe it's time for Texas to secede" and "please secede". Those expressing such sentiments underwhelm me with their sympathy and amuse me with their apparent privilege. I was born into a yeller-dawg-Democrat family in Texas over 61 years ago. I and my circle have been progressive Texas Dems since long before it was fashionable. As with many states, Texas cities are blue islands in a sea of rural red counties. While my wife and I might have the resources to up and move out of Texas, this state is full of people trapped here by circumstance. Such 'secession' sentiments write those people off. They are, apparently, unimportant to those believing it would make everyone else more comfortable if Texas went its own way.

    1. Katelynne Shouse's Avatar Katelynne Shouse

      Perhaps the US government could assist those without the means to relocate to do so.....and in their place an equal amount of jackass's could take their spots in Texas. Not an ideal solution I grant you but something is going to have to be tried before the next Civil War starts. And honestly it's merely a match tip strike away from exploding in every single person's face!

  1. Richard Lee Cornell's Avatar Richard Lee Cornell

    As I heard from a friend who sells all sorts of street drugs, that this anti-abortion law in Texas is a windfall for those who take drugs. The Mexican Drug Cartel used to put a bounty on the heads of the Republican lawmakers in Texas for putting up a wall on the border between Mexico and the US. What was a $1,000 a head have jump to 10 grand a head. Matching the States, 10 grand, put on doctors heads. Texas with its lax gun laws might find that drug users are willing to kill a few lawmakers for that kind of money. Planned Parenthood has call the bluff of the Texas lawmakers by telling their clients about the welfare programs that are in Texas. That the State will give her vast sums of wealth for having a unwanted child. A welfare mom can easily pull in $30,000/year for having a unwanted child.

  1. Gary's Avatar Gary

    All is well we each will realize the truth as we remember who we really are, what we really are. There is no judgement, ever for anything. Search within yourself to remember.

  1. Norma Battes's Avatar Norma Battes

    Give it back to the ones it was stole from. Pronto!

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