McKrae Game, once an emergent voice in the conversion therapy movement, has now renounced his past activity and has come out as gay.

One of South Carolina's most notorious conversion therapists has come out of the closet.

McKrae Game, who led one of the nation's largest faith-based conversion therapy programs for nearly two decades, has publicly admitted that he's gay and disavowed the very "harmful" practices he forced on so many just like him.

"I was a religious zealot that hurt people," he told The Post and Courier, two years after the board of directors of Hope for Wholeness fired him from the same organization he founded. "People said they attempted suicide over me and the things I said to them. People, I know, are in therapy because of me. Why would I want that to continue?"

Instead, the 51-year-old has now joined several former conversion therapy advocates who have come out as LGBTQ and since pushed to end the widely discredited practice. Conversion therapy is intended to suppress and eventually change a person's sexual orientation or gender through a combination of shame, counseling, and religious teaching. However, long-term studies have shown that not only does this type of "therapy" fail to accomplish its primary goal, it also causes severe and long-lasting psychological harm. The practice has been repeatedly condemned by the American Psychological Association and is currently banned in 18 states across the country.

Undoing the Harm

Bracing for the intense backlash from those he traumatized, Game posted a Facebook update last week that began: "I WAS WRONG! Please forgive me!"

While most who responded were quick to accept that apology and offer their online support for his decision to come clean, some people remain skeptical as to how Mr. Game plans to atone for the damage his ex-gay ministry had done. Wrote one Facebook user:

"People killed themselves as a result of the mental and emotional anguish caused by ministries like this, and others were kicked out of their homes because of false assurances by ministry leaders that they could change if they really wanted to. Charles Colson, after his repentance, founded Prison Fellowship as a way to make amends. What will you do?"

Others echoed the sentiment, insisting that forgiveness will require more than just an apology. Game has no illusions about his destructive role in the lives of thousands. "I created it all," he said about Hope for Wholeness. "We have harmed generations of people."

For his part, he's been meeting with critics and responding to angry messages. Game talked with LGBTQ activist Kim Williams, who said that she came to "eat him alive." But after chatting with Game, Williams says she realizes that "he was just as abused and brainwashed as the people he wanted to save. He was suffering."

What Game intends to do beyond meeting with those he's harmed will be a test of his character.

Life After A Lie

Game says he has more peace now than ever before. He and his wife are still together. He's still a Christian. And he's working on a book to talk about his experiences and reconcile the harm his organization has done.

Said Game on Facebook: "It's all in my past, but many, way TOO MANY continue believing that there is something wrong with themselves and wrong with people that choose to live their lives honestly and open as gay, lesbian, trans, etc. The very harmful cycle of self shame and condemnation has to stop. It's literally killing people!! Learn to love. Learn to love yourself and others."

What do you think? Are apologies enough for McKrae Game to undo the trauma his organization subjected thousands of innocent people to? Or does true atonement require more than just saying "I'm sorry"?


  1. Carrie's Avatar Carrie

    Here it is, once again someone who says they "hate gays" or "the life style is a choice" or any other stupid excuse you might choose, either come out as gay or are caught in a compromising situation with a child or someone of the same sex. Homophobia isn't fear of homosexuals, it is fear that you are a homosexual. Anything you express hatred for is something within yourself that provokes you. If you are in tune with yourself, you neither have any fear, nor any concern about how others live their lives as long as they are not causing harm. If you don't want to see what your neighbor does, build a fence so you don't. Don't call them out and try to shame them for what they do on their own property. Gay conversion therapy is a savage form of torture...only proving that you approve of punishing others to make yourself feel better about your own empty life. Bright Blessings

    1. Stephanie Willey's Avatar Stephanie Willey

      I could not agree more. Homophobia is an intimately personal fear of ones innermost feelings.

      1. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'wily': You have expressed a biased, restrictive and partial view of 'homophobia'. The dictionary, also, defines homophobia as an AVERSION to the PRACTICE of homosexuality. The practice of homosexuality is abhorrent, abnormal, and repugnant. This viewpoint is shared by most decent people.

        1. Robyn Reviere's Avatar Robyn Reviere

          Flugo, I I am a decent person and I find your lack of empathy judgmental and therefore sinful. Think about it. Perhaps you also suffer from the self hate of confused sexuality? Prayers for you as you step down from the judges bench.

          1. flugo's Avatar flugo

            'robin': We ARE to judge! In John 7:24 Jesus told us to 'judge' in a proper fashion. And, in Luke 17:3 we are encouraged to 'rebuke'. It goes without saying, that sensible, intelligent people use discernment, appraisal, discrimination and wisdom in determining what is right, good and edifying.

            Prayers for YOU that you'll post factual information, NOT just your wild-ass blathering.

            1. John D. Partin's Avatar John D. Partin

              Flugo Bob Fluess Marx, what do sensible and intelligent people or discernment, appraisal, discrimination, and wisdom have to do with you, since you are neither of those things and don't practice any of those things, as is shown by your stating that you had sexual fantasies about your own sister in a post under the name of Bob Fluess and by all the GARBAGE!! that you spew in all of your posts here!! Yes, Jesus said to judge, but he said "Judge a RIGHTEOUS!! judgment", which isn't the kind that you and other homophobes, bigots, hypocrites, and religious phonies, such as yourself, indulge in, judging other people by appearances and hatefully, covering over your hatefulness with a very thin veneer of "Christianity" and "love" and "concern for their souls"!! But your true colors and hatefulness are constantly peeking out from behind your camouflage and pretense, and so you are only fooling yourself and other easily fooled people with all of that!! Not anyone else!! God never said that homosexuality is a sin because those words were only put into his mouth by Bible writers, so as to reinforce their own views about it and impose them on other people even easier!! Jesus didn't approve of judgment without any qualifications because even Nazis and Klansmen and hypocrites such as you judge, but all of judge WRONGLY!!! Wake up and smell the coffee and get wise to yourself before YOU!! end in the Hell here on Earth and beyond that you are always warning other people about!! Get a clue, for a change!!!

          2. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

            The disparaging comments about homosexuality are faith-based opinions, not facts. These ideas were brought out thousands of years ago. This was a time of superstition and belief in anything that was not a "normal" event of life. I would not want to be treated medically as that population was at that time.Homosexuality is a stepping stone to condemn human beings who are not the same as us. This is not to say that faith-based beliefs are completely untrue but that scientific information is a more reliable. To believe that homosexuality is a choice and/or are sinning is simply is not true. There is no evidence that supports that view.

            What are we doing to help our fellow man?

        2. Lori's Avatar Lori

          I, too, feel sorry for you flugo. You have been brought up, or taught, to believe certain things are true and you cannot move past the antiquated voices in you mind regardless of what is a genetic truth. These things you psychologically reject as abhorrent, abnormal and repugnant are merely an echo in your mind and a description of those who are homophobic. Which is what you actually are. Homophobia is not associated with decent people. Phobias refer to a fear of some kind. They are fears that create unnecessary aversions to things that actually won't cause you harm.
          You, being Christian, are not aware that you are being controlled by the voices of very closed minded people who have refused to actually live their faith. Perhaps you should focus more on the "loving one another" and expressing compassion and good will.

    2. terry's Avatar terry

      I agree with you . mckray game is proof of this.

    3. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

      although fundamentalists want to believe this about gays, they have not read what the bible says about gays. Too simple to encourage hate. We are not born with prejudice this is a learned idea without substance.

      1. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'miser': What DOES the Bible say about gays?!

        1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

          The Bible makes good rolling papers.

      2. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'miser': I'm waiting . . . what DOES the Bible say about gays?

    4. Norma Battes's Avatar Norma Battes

      So why don't I like rich people that have sex all the time?

      1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

        Could it be because they have more expensive toys than you can afford, Norma?

    5. flugo's Avatar flugo

      'caries': In your above posting, your definition of 'homophobia' is NOT found in any reputable dictionary! And your following sentence is a gross, unsubstantiated, wild, generalization. Your lack of scholarship is obvious.

      1. Carrie's Avatar Carrie

        Your mumbling is nonsensical, to say the least. Don't waggle your biblical digit toward me. For those who insist on citing the Bible:. It is a cool book with some wonderful passages but it also has ghost sex, Giants, superbabies and demons. That's why we don't make laws based on Game Of Thrones, My Little Pony or Legend of Zelda. If you have any faith, Keep it to yourself! It means nothing to me.

      2. ridges54's Avatar ridges54

        The Oxford dictionary says:dislike of or prejudice against homosexual people. Sounds fairly consistent with Carrie's view.

        1. flugo's Avatar flugo

          'caries'/'rigid': The Merriam-Webster dictionary also lists the definition of homophobia as 'aversion to homosexuality'. This address the practice and lifestyle of some of the LGBTQxyz-ers. The focus is on what they are DOING. The holy, righteous God of the universe also has this aversion, by the way.

          1. Lori's Avatar Lori

            flugo... a phobia, of any kind, is an extreme or irrational fear of something. You are homophobic. And you are also arrogant, egotistical, and self righteous. You, nor anyone else knows what God has aversions to. It just might be arrogance and self righteousness. Anyone who thinks they have all the answers is really no mentally sound and strugglings with their own identity. Also, it is fact that there are genetic differences that move a person's sexuality one way or the other. Your righteous God has created everyone. Are you saying God has an aversion his/her own creation????

        2. flugo's Avatar flugo

          'rigid/lorry': You needn't be exclusive about what the dictionary says in order to suit your bias. Besides your viewpoint, Merriam-Webster includes the the aversion of the homosexual PRACTICE as well as the person.

          And, because it's a depraved, repugnant departure from His original design, God does have an 'aversion' to the LGBTQxyz-ers' lifestyle. (Leviticus 18). And, an 'aversion toward' all sin: (John 3:36, Psalm 11:5, and many others).

          And, though God may have created all people, but He didn't create their sinful ways.

          1. Lori's Avatar Lori

            You're a wall, flugo. Enjoy your life

          2. Daniel's Avatar Daniel

            Unfortunately the tendency is to still interpret God as being Male; and usually as an old white man with a beard. Consider that in this time based reality of physical existence it is ALL founded on the illusion of dualities; positive and negative magnetic polarities, light and dark, Male and female, and even subjective interpretations of good and evil. A God who is outside of and beyond time, while also embracing every possible manifestation within time, could not exist as being only one half of the duality. Therefore, inspite of the historical dominant patriarchs, God's true essence is neither Male nor female, while at the same "time" being BOTH. Exile from God, for subjective interpretations of "sin" is NOT possible as there could not be ANY place of exile unless God created it, and thereby maintained a presence there as well. God ALLOWS us to have our ILLUSIONS of separation; like kids playing peek-a-boo at the dinner table. I believe that ANYONE, even members of the LGBTQ community who follows the two greatest commandments to give all to God while helping their neighbor is more connected to God than those who would try to separate themselves through prejudicial condemnation. The man in this story recognized his own errors. By grace he is "saved" from himself. Apologies are a good start but the question remains as to what else he may need to do to restore the sense of connection to the people who were injured by his errors.

    6. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      I'm not the one who was sent to forgive, and Game won't receive any from me. Call me Pontius Pilot if you will, but I say "Crucify him !!!"

    7. flugo's Avatar flugo

      'caries': 'Homophobia . . . is fear that you are a homosexual.' So tell us . . . what dictionary substantiates your wild, faulty bias?

      Following your ignorant, inane example: Fear of drowning means one is drowning?! Fear of spiders means one is bitten by spiders?! Fear of catching HIV means one has HIV?!

      What an absurdity your posting is! It's so typical of your rambling blather.


    Wow! The more things change, the more they stay the same! I get to say: "I called it on this one!" Oh well, better late than never dude. Welcome to the party, pal!

  1. Catherine Ohrin-Greipp MSW's Avatar Catherine Ohrin-Greipp MSW

    "Conversion Therapy" is not legitimate nor is it "therapy " It is purely brainwashing by Christian hypocrites who live a double life. Homosesxuality is not a mental disorder, not diagnosable. As a long time multi-state licensed and board certified psychotherapist, all I can say is that these kind of people who are "arm chair wannabe therapists, are totally disgusting and dangerous. If anyone of these fake "therapists" were actually state licensed in a mental health field, they would be reported and their licenses would be revoked.I hope that anyone who was a victim will sue him. His victims owe him nothing.

    1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

      Correct. Conversion therapy is a 100% failure.

      1. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'miser': ". . . .100% failure." Only a fool would make such an unsubstantiated, outlandish, and error-riddled assumption! It's embarrassing for you to display your ignorance in such a manner.

        1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

          This has been studied by academics many times. It doesn't work. Some will become celibate. This is not conversion. Could conversion change you to gay? This is genetic predisposition, not a failing of a spirit.

          When I have more time I'll explain my part on gays. Thanks for the opportunities.

          1. flugo's Avatar flugo

            'miser': What 'part' of yours do you have 'on gays'?! Where do you position your 'part'? Do the gays have any say in where you put your 'part'?

          2. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

            The promise I made.......when I had more time. See below. BTW Flugo, I'm not a fool. Well, I hope know not.

      2. flugo's Avatar flugo

        'miser': Again, I question your assertions that say conversion therapy is a 100% failure. And, again, I ask you what the Bible says about gays. (re. both your 11 Sep postings)

        1. John D. Partin's Avatar John D. Partin

          Flugo Marx aka Bob Fluess, it doesn't matter what the Bible says about gay people, anymore than it matters what you and other homophobes today are saying about gay people, because the verses against homosexuality in the Bible were written by homophobes and so are a biased source of "information", put into God's mouth in order to reinforce those views and impose them on other people even easier!! Why is someone like you, who fantasized about having sex with your own sister, talking about anyone else's "perversion", being such a big PERVERT!! yourself?!! Homosexuality is entirely natural, normal, and healthy, unlike yourself!!

  1. Jerry's Avatar Jerry

    "... and I just listened. That what we all should have been [doing]. Just been there and listening to people. But somewhat it was changing and fixing people". Just all remember what your basic lessons "one shall not judge" and make yourself available to listen and try to understand. We would then have a better world with less anger, sorrows and sufferings.

    1. Lori's Avatar Lori

      Yes, you are absolutely right, Jerry. Thanks for saying this.

      1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

        AMEN Jerry.

  1. Amber's Avatar Amber

    A little slow on the pick up with this one. It seems that conversion therapy has been pretty much denounced by most in the mental health field of medicine for a number of years now. This seems to be more about behavior manipulation or modification over actual diagnosis and treatment of anything... often by brutal, self deprecating methods that do a lot more harm than any good.

    1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

      I am a retired clinical psychologist and have worked with many homosexuals. Listening and understanding is what they don't have from the family, friends and church.

  1. Amber's Avatar Amber

    I have to add that once he's manage to work through his own self loathing issues, that yes, he should do more than just apologize. He just needs to be sure he has healed enough first. He should see if there is some way to help counsel people in self love and acceptance.

    1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

      You are so correct! Hence the reason they hide their identity so long. Once self acceptance is in place the ego is raised to a plateau of stability.

  1. William Plante's Avatar William Plante

    We are born in the Image of God. Because of fear of the repercussions, it took me 75 years to come out only to find a loving and understanding family. Conversation therapists want to change God's will!

    1. flugo's Avatar flugo

      'willy': 'God's will'? To what are you referring as 'God's will'?!

  1. flugo's Avatar flugo

    'He's still a Christian.' Garne . . . a practicing gay AND a Christian?! What a crock! Two blatant antithetical misconceptions are touted here: What is a 'Christian' and the lifestyle of 'practicing homosexuality'. They cannot co-exist!

    1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

      You finally said something I agree with,, Fluga. Christianity is a crock!

      1. flugo's Avatar flugo

        Elfstrom as usual . . . using the diversionary, instead of head-on with the facts.

        Any discerning, intelligent reader will readily note that I said nothing about Christianity. I DID suggest that practicing homosexuality and being a Christian are antithetical.

        Instead of skewing a posting to your bias, you'd do well to be fair and honest in your comments.

        1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

          Hi Flugo,

          Watching your posts, I think you may be in the wrong conversation, or chat. From what I've seen, you post only oppositional texts to what others have posted. It appears you are posting as a "troll" and, with me, it's worn off. If I'm wrong, your posts will change.

          Good luck.

  1. Leslie Gray's Avatar Leslie Gray

    Conversion therapy is a farce, a lie told to its victims to give them false hope and destroy their lives so that the practioners can exert power and nothing more. This despicable practice is rooted in the false notion that gay and transgender people choose to be how they are. Nobody deserves to be tortured for the way they were born.

    I know. I endured conversion therapy at the hands of men calling themselves men of God. When they were unsuccessful, my farther took me to doctors who also tried and failed to force me too be cisgender.

    The practice of conversion therapy is widely and wisely condemned by every main stream medical and mental health organization and must not be practiced.

  1. Oh Mo's Avatar Oh Mo


  1. Randy's Avatar Randy

    Forget what the Bible says about gays... what is God telling you now...if you can eliminate your person feeling? The Bible could be wrong because of all the possible way it could have been changed by so many people through the ages. Put it aside and find the answer within.

  1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

    Sodom and sodomites: The word “Sodom” does not refer to sexual activities. “Sodom” refers to the nearby mountain named Sodom. The meaning of the term is salt. Most of us are familiar with Lot’s wife turning into a pillar of salt. With the explanation comes an insight into more reality. In those days it was not uncommon for workers/slaves to sleep in one area apart from others. This led to the belief that they were having sex among themselves. (BTW, the term homosexuals did not exist at that time. This is a term used to disenfranchise a part of our population religiously.

    The book of Leviticus also prohibits what you can eat and prescribes animal sacrifices. The only rules of the Old Testament that apply to us today are the rules that are repeated in the New Testament. We don’t live under the old law. We live under the new law of God. The New Testament says nothing about dietary restrictions or animal sacrifices, but it does repeat the commands about adultery, premarital sex, and homosexuality.

    The New Testament also talks about homosexual marriage. Jesus talked about this in Matthew 19. The Pharisees said, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any reason at all?” (v. 3). Jesus answered, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So, they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate” (vv. 4-6). Jesus was saying, “If you want to know the answer to the divorce question, then let’s look at God’s original plan for marriage. Genesis says marriage is one man with one woman for a lifetime.” By affirming God’s standard, Jesus was saying that any deviation from that standard–not just gay marriage but any deviation, such as adultery, premarital sex, or unbiblical divorce–is sin because it doesn’t measure up to the perfect standard of God. Jesus said marriage is one man with one woman for a lifetime. How many more of us are sinning through divorce and affairs?

    In the new testament era, homosexuals were valued. When married men went to war, homosexuals remainded with the women. The men were confident that the women would be sexually safe. Homosexuals were called Eunuchs.

    There are so many ideas and views about the scriptures, this is right, this is wrong. We therefore have Catholics, many different protestants, all claiming their belief is the right one. I am not a dogmatist! My belief is rooted in the words of Christ. Many attend church; religion remains inside. This is a long-held habit that the church is where God is worshiped. True spiritually and care for our fellowman needs to be practiced in day to day life. This was the command set forth by the Christ. Belief inside, action on the outside.

    The church I pastor is founded solely of the following which does not include dogma. (Dogma takes up too much time and many views, keeping us from the mission.) Each member must “agree” to go out into the world and serve their fellowman as best they can. This is our belief and mission. Remember that during that time very few could write and barely anyone could read. We need to use the knowledge and education we has been bestowed on us through time by God. It is not a sin to use knowledge we have today rather than picking scriptures from the past which are obsolete and misunderstood. I am a Progressive Revelationist. I believe God continues to give us more insight as time progresses. The bible should not have a back cover. It should be open to permit more blessings to us as we can grow spiritually.

    Matthew 25:35-40

    35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’ 37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’ 40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.

    This is my belief and work. God bless.

    1. flugo's Avatar flugo

      'miser': WRONG, again! By definition a 'eunuch' is a castrated male. NOT a homosexual! Pull your head out!

  1. fred klink's Avatar fred klink

    this is what freedom from religion is about stopping this bullshit yes any one can step in claiming to knows what god wants for you making claim based on very old lies. you know my way or death when your dead dumbass it is to late then. beat the queer out him / her better yet use the bible that will show um we ain't crazy. head history nothing has ever worked when gods in charge now has it grow up look around the lies are showing themselves. look at what them good forks keep praising the crazy one big cheese. can anyone say devil. religion is the reason bad shit happens what was the question l being a human is more then just being,

    1. Darryl Mizer's Avatar Darryl Mizer

      Good one. Time to catch up to the times.

  1. Carl Bernard Elfstrom's Avatar Carl Bernard Elfstrom

    Fluga must be confused. She writes things which make it seem like she thinks this is a Christian blog, but it's not. And why would anyone other than Christians read the Bible, or care what it says. Sure, there are Christians on this blog, but most of those he ever addresses are not.

  1. Albert A Hernandez's Avatar Albert A Hernandez

    Homosexuality is an abomination to GOD. The Scriptures are very clear about this. When we deviate from the laws of God, we are playing with fire. Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed by God because of this sin. America is becoming more and more like them and we are paying the price (mass shootings, extreme weather, war, disease). This is not an opinion. We must be very careful.

    Albert A. Hernandez, D. Div.

    1. flugo's Avatar flugo

      Excellent, and to the point!

    2. Daniel's Avatar Daniel

      Again with subjective misinterpretation; this time about Sodom and Gomorrah. First, consider that, during those times, sin was defined as ANYTHING that separates you from God. Now consider how the Christ's basic message is that there is no REAL separation from God. So, when the heavenly messengers went to check out Sodom and Gomorrah, with their manifest higher energy frequencies the people could only experience that higher energy through the denser energy of wanting to have sex with them. Thus, it was not WHAT they were doing, it was the fact that they had gotten lost in what they were doing and could not tap into their own higher energy centers in order to fully relate to the messengers. Remember Christ said we are in the world but not of the world. Life is meant to be experienced, but NOT to get lost in. I believe there are many members of the LGBTQ community who are MORE in synch with their higher energy centers, and God, than some of the would-be traditionalists who are still stuck in their lower sexual energy (even if it's just with their husbands or wives) and who are therefore more akin to the people of Sodom and Gomorrah.

    3. John D. Partin's Avatar John D. Partin

      Albert A. Hernandez, as I've told many other people here and am now telling you. the Bible only calls homosexuality a "sin" in those few places because it was written by homophobes, in order to make God "agree with them" and reinforce and sanction and "justify" their own views about it and impose them on other people even easier! Besides, if you are going to go strictly by what the Bible calls "right" or "wrong", the Bible also says that slavery is "right" and if that teaching had been followed, the Civil War that freed black people from slavery wouldn't have been fought and they would still be in slavery. The Bible also says that wearing linen and wool together is "wrong", and that eating shellfish is "wrong", and that many other things are "wrong", but Christians aren't following all of these other prohibitions. They are only singling out homosexuality from among all of these prohibitions to pay any attention to, due to their bigotry against homosexuality! That is a double standard and very selective following of the law. Love overrules teachings against homosexuality that were written by bigots and put into God's mouth. Jesus said that we would be known as his followers by our love for one another, not by dislike and hatred for gay people and persecution of them. We will be judged on love. Many people try to have it both ways and have their cake and eat it, too, by saying that "love is shown by warning people about this sin (homosexuality)", according to them, but that is, quite clearly, wrong-headed thinking. Love isn't submissive to bigotry or determined or defined by it. Bigotry is defeated by love, not the other way around!

  1. flugo's Avatar flugo

    'dannyhell'; Where did you get that garbage that 'Christ's basic message is that there is no REAL separation from God'?!

    1. Daniel's Avatar Daniel

      Okay. For starters, let's consider one of the main aspects of current "christianity" that totally missed the mark: How often have you heard "Christ died for your sins"? But Christ NEVER died. He told his disciples he was going away for three days but he'd be back, and they weren't ready to come with him yet. He was trying to show that we are NOT the physical body, just temporary residents in it. The disciples didnt understand because they still identified themselves as being physical bodies. This same error persists to the current day. Plus Christ NEVER sent his disciples out to tell people he was going to be the yom Kippur sacrificial lamb/scape goat. So then, if "Christ died for your sins" is not the message, then what WAS the message? Now, knowing that the definition of sin for the Jewish people at the time of Christ was anything that separates you from God (which included anything not directly addressed by the many laws under the Torah), how is it that following the Christ and accepting his examples and teachings absolves sin? Christ never condemned the prostitute about to be stoned, nor any other person who was thought to be unclean or sinful. His disciples included a former despised tax collector. And who is your neighbor? Yes, even all those who we may so easily despise or relegate to a lesser standing of being a "sinner", heretic or unbeliever. Finally consider the two greatest commandments: hold to God with all you have and are and then help each other out. Why are these two the greatest? Because it was the illusion of Adam and Eve to first put separation between themselves and to then think they could hide from God in the bushes. Leaving the Garden was the natural result of them choosing fear and separation. Or at least the illusion of separation. Even the illusion of death appears as the ultimate separation. "Death where is thy sting?" And, again, where could anyone possibly go to separate themselves from God when Everything and Everywhere is ALL only possible through the grace of Gods creations. And God is omnipotent and omnipresent. Thus- there is no REALseparation possible, even though God allows us to cling to our illusions of such.

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