When Maeen Ali first read about the "Punish a Muslim Day" letter campaign that rocked England last spring, the 38-year-old Yemeni immigrant's thoughts quickly turned to the safety of his own four children living in his Brooklyn neighborhood.
For Ali, the idea that anyone would reward hate crimes ranging from pulling off a woman's head scarf to actually bombing mosques with "points" was downright frightening. "That's when I said to myself that it was really important to come out and protect Muslims in the community," he explained.
Nearly a year on from that revelation, Ali has now joined 29 other members of the country's first all-Muslim, all-volunteer community police force.
Hitting the Streets
Trained in part by off-duty officers, members of the unarmed and self-funded Muslim Community Patrol & Services work in shifts to patrol schools, mosques and bus stops in Brooklyn in an effort to keep streets safe for Muslims. Eventually the plan is to expand to all of New York City. Although the group has their own squad cars, they will work in conjunction with traditional police - be it reporting suspicious activity or offering on-the-scene translation services - and seek to link residents to food pantries and counseling services.
"It's like a neighborhood watch but on steroids," explains Noor Rabah, the group's 31-year-old vice president. "We know our place: We are not cops. We are simply patrollers for the community that also serve as the eyes and ears for the N.Y.P.D."
But not everyone sees it that way.
Fears Arise
When a photo of the Muslim squad's patrol car turned up on Facebook in late December, concerns quickly spread about how similar the cars look to regular NYPD vehicles.
Critics say these patrol cars and the very idea of an all-Muslim police force is troubling. We wouldn't want any normal police force to be comprised entirely of one single religious group, they say. So why should a community policing group be any different? They worry that volunteers may bring their own views and biases to the position, and, despite meaning well, might end up causing more issues than they prevent.
Of course, not all the negative reactions have been as level-headed. Some conspiracy theorists are convinced that Muslim community policing is the first step toward an Islamic takeover. Particularly nasty messages have been circulated online alleging that the patrol is some kind of prelude to a full-blown imposition of Shariah law.
Should the Group Be Allowed to Exist?
Nevertheless, it's easy to understand why the Muslim community feels a need to look out for each other. New York City is home to roughly 22 percent of America's Muslim population, and authorities recorded 32 hate crime incidents in the city during the 2018 calendar year alone.
However, even some in the Muslim community have their doubts about the efficacy of a patrol force out on the streets. They worry it will only exacerbate an "us vs. them" cultural divide that many Muslims living in Western countries report experiencing. Some also expressed concern that a single misstep on the part of police volunteers could damage the reputation of the city's entire Muslim community.
What do you think? Should NYC's Muslims be given the green light to operate their own police force, or do critics raise legitimate concerns?
87 comments
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hsw
The truth about our police forces is that they have little power to prevent crime, other than by their presence, and most forces are woefully undermanned. I don’t see a substantial difference between this and any other neighborhood watch group. They’re eyes and ears when the police aren’t always there.
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Susan
Agreed.
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Tracie Richardson
You have your rights to be a law abiding citizen of america! Are we not the land of the free? If you are here then follow the laws in place. Dont like it, then leave!
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Kirk
I read that there are Asian, Jewish and other patrol groups operating as well. Why can’t those groups pool resources and work like a regular volunteer unsegregated force? Seems like an al-whatever force will make divides greater.
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cbcuff
Existing police forces are already mandated to protect any and all citizens from harassment and discrimination. But collectively they fail to do that. The reason is, well, discrimination. This is America after all. It still lacks the political will, and not about being "undermanned" as a previous writer has noted.. With the current attitude in the US, the more police=more discrimination.
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The Rev. Dr. Marion Ceruti
You are right about other patrol groups. One example is the Shomrim of Crown Heights, NY. Neighborhood patrols should be fine as long as they comply with existing civil law and not try to enforce religious law, whether it be the Halacha or Sharia law on members of other groups. For example, it is OK with me if the Shomrim tell Orthodox Jewish males that their fringes are not showing, but it is not OK with me if they tell Hindu ladies wearing traditional saris that they have to cover up. Similarly, the Muslim group sponsoring a neighborhood watch should be fine so long as they watch over their own group members and refrain from enforcing Sharia law on everyone.
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ET
They have a right to defend their community. Police cannot be everywhere. The Muslim’s can be the extended eyes and ears of the regular police. (Disclaimer: I’m not a Muslim nor a Christian. I support our Constitution.)
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Roy C. Wilson
Viewing their website they call themselves a "community patrol", not a police force. I do think they made a mistake in having a patrol car that resembles a police car. Although I tend to be against vigilantes they do seem to be well intentioned and I would imagine that they will be under very close scrutiny and may have to spend a lot of time, in today's atmosphere, fending off unwarranted criticism and attack. I doubt they could ever be as agressive as the Guardian Angels. I believe they will be a positive force in the community.
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Tom B
Rev....I agree; if they dispense with the NYCPD patrol car look-a-likes, let them function as a community patrol...it is just unfortunate it is all Muslim, instead of everyone protecting a community...Peace...Tom
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Dewayne Smith
Rev. I agree with all you said until "I doubt..." and "I believe …" If you get the chance, and you are not a Muslim, go to Dearborn Michigan on a holiday, and just take a nice walk through the city. Their "protection force" will follow you and question you about your presents in their city. Heaven forbid that you have a Bible or Christian tracts in your hand. If so you will be ask to leave.
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Kitty
I’m not Muslim and I grew up outside Dearborn and have lived in Detroit - it’s not as it would seem from such a comment!! Although like all places, radicals can be anywhere.
You should always be smart and know your own place in this world!
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FRESHWHIPS462
I've seen private security vehicles that look like police cars every city that I've lived in. I've also seen police cars that don't look like police cars.
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Freddy Guerra
This needs to stop no cause that look like NYPD police cars should be used they should have their own symbols and they should be monitored One Security force of one religion is not good go back to the brown shirts of Nazi Germany that worked out good didn't it
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pcfield
I have to agree here, in other Muslim communities throughout the States they will force you out of their towns, the local police are afraid of them and will not interfere in their abuse of Christians.Thanks to Obama, those towns are no longer a part of the US, they are breeding grounds for Islam where no other ideals are allowed. To be a true believer one must kill the non-believers/infidels it is the law to them. They are also told to lie and fool non-believers into thinking they are peaceful and harmless so they can gain their trust, but when the call to kill the infidels comes, it will not be a problem for them. Just be aware, it is like living where there are a lot of poisonous snakes, watch where you are stepping, listen and never turn your back to them. Meanwhile, live in peace...not hate.
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Kitty
Wow ?
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Lionheart
I suspect from what I've heard from other countries that have these patrols, that there are underlying intentions to slowly get an Islamic foothold within certain communities, so that they can become stronger and stronger. Some patrols are already chastising none Islamic females for not adhering to muslin dress codes in their muslim neighborhood. I've seen videos of these females saying "This is the United States and we can dress how we want", and the reply was "No you can't, this is an Islamic neighborhood" Someone needs the testicles to clamp down on this behavior before it gets out of hand, but I doubt it will happen as they would be classed as an Islamophobe.
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guidvce4
I totally agree with you, Lionheart. No religious patrols need be added to the normal NYPD presence. If someone assaults a moozie for whatever, then process it as it warrants. This is nothing more than an attempt by the moozies trying to gain a foothold inside this nation by projecting a presence of legitimacy, which it is not. "Islamophobia" is nothing more than bs way of shutting up any dissention of whatever actions the adherents to that ideology may institute to further their unconstitutional behavior. The teachings in Koran do not jive with the US Constitution. Can't assimilate in this nation? Go back to the Middle East and live their ideology in whatever manner they want to. They are free to do that at any time.
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pcfield
Amen!
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Roger Hittle
Well this is just like the maga church tgat started their own police but as a neighborhood watch unit it shows that the community saw a need and filled it other areas in NYC have their watch units lets see how this works before we condemn them do not pre judge
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Benjamin Muhammad Amin Jones
Agreed
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angel
It's no different then hiring a security company to provide security. They have the right to make civil arrests and to protect their community so long as they don't break any laws doing so. If the vehicles they use look to much like local LE, then their needs to be a compromise. But what you people don't get is that Security companies do the same thing! So unless you are against your local security company, then you literally have no leg to stand on and stop your whining. Oh, and I have yet to see them present themselves as local LE, so you need to stop writing your articles to imply something that is simply not true. Now your looking more the the Liberal Lies at CNN!!
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Rev. Rene
My thoughts are this: If they have the intention to be a force for good, and are willing to spend the time and money to be a responsible patrol force, then be one by all means!!! Become legal police officers, secure funding from the Muslim community to fund uniforms, patrol cars, and kit such as tasers, guns, radio's, etc. and make an agreement with the police leadership and city council to be patrolling in predominantly Muslim neighborhoods (if that is the intention.) Personally, I would feel as comfortable with a Christian, Muslim, Hindu, or whoever is qualified as a trained police officer. Just do not be another "quasi vigilante force".
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Benjamin Muhammad Amin Jones
Amen, Ameen to that
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Rev Dr Ryan
That supposed letter did not 'rock' England, the BBC can be relied upon to have made such a letter national news, yet there was no mention of it. Whilst there are certain exceptions, Great Britain is one of the most tolerant countries in the world when it comes to race relations, to the extent that some Asian criminals were allowed to break laws that were very serious - all due to political correctness. Just look up Kriss Donald in Wikipedia and you will see how racially motivated attacks against whites by a Pakistani gang are ignored by the BBC. These Muslim community patrols can be one step away from vigilante action, or imposing Sharia Law against Muslims who are seen not to be following it. It is as much for the protection of the Liberal Muslims that these patrols are stopped. However well meaning the intention, Muslims and non Muslims alike are right to be concerned about the potential harm that may arise from the patrols, or what they will lead to. If there is a problem with policing it is the job of the police commissioner to resolve the issue. What is going to happen if women, gays, transgender, Hindis, the Mormons, or 7th Day Adventists decide that they want a patrol to protect them? No. It is the duty of police officers to provide protection jot self-appointed groups, no matter how well trained they may be, otherwise its the beginning of the end and it will result in segregation not assimilation
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tom
This should simply be a neighborhood watch where citizens of whatever religion or no religion is paying attention in the neighborhood and when something odd is happening, or someone is clearly in danger or something clearly illegal is happening they are witnesses, help if they can but also call law enforcement.
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Jim D.
If they are not breaking any laws, then there is no problem. Simple as that.
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Lionheart
That's exactly what people thought in Sweden, and Belgium, (and Germany before WW2). It's too late now, those countries are lost to Islam.
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Jim D.
True, but that's because when those groups started breaking the law, authorities were slow and/or reluctant to act, probably because they do not want to be seen as insensitive to a select group of the population and be perceived as racially or culturally motivated in their law enforcement. The leadership in those countries has proven to be weak and allowed this sub-culture to run roughshod over its citizens.
A good and careful leader will protect a country like he/she protects a household. For example, if you have a guest staying at your house for an unspecified period of time (until this guest gets back on their feet after a life-altering event), you explain the rules of the house, and then do what you can to make your guest comfortable. If your guest breaks a rule of the house (e.g. smoking indoors), you waste no time in reminding them of the rules. If your guest does it again, you pack them up and drop them off at the bus station. An effective leader will do the same with guests in their country.
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John Owens
...as in our present commander-in-chief, although he meets with a lot of obstruction.
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Philip Ryan
Quiz custodiet ipsos custodes? Who is to know whether they are or are not, breaking laws? In the UK some Muslim communities are following Sharia law and not British law and it has seen many outrages, which were ignored in the 'interests' of political correctness . Even Baroness Warsi announced that there were counter cultures that were developing in parallel to the British way of life. This is insidious and dangerous. Allowing intolerant cultures to flourish, unchecked, will see the British way of life lost within a few generations, aided and abetted by the very politicians who are meant to protect it.
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Tom B
Philip Ryan...what you state is exactly what is happening in France, city by city...life should be governed by ethics; not by organized religions...Peace...Tom
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Philip Ryan
It is happening in Germany too. There must be curbs placed upon all intolerant religions. Unfortunately, the intolerant factions use the freedoms bestowed upon them by liberal, democratic nations to impose their intolerant views. We just have to look to Middle Eastern Muslim countries to see what our future may become. Enslaving women, throwing gays off tall buildings, to their deaths, cutting hands off minor criminals are not hallmarks of advanced cultures and civilisations; these are the practices of barbaric and primitive societies, ruled under the dictatorship of mullahs who twist the words of their religion to justify what no decent person could accept as the true word of any god. Many reasonable Muslims abhor this, but fear speaking out, lest they find themselves being tortured and killed by the religious police. Yet to stand up to this risks you being branded a racist, or Islamophobic. As true Christians, we have a moral duty to stand up against hatred and intolerance, wherever we find it. If we don't, we face losing the right to practice our religion on pain of death. Demography is against us and we need to preserve the right of future generations to practice Christianity. In the UK a Muslim girl who ran away to join Isis and become a child bride to a 24 year old Dutch convert jihadist, now wants to return to the UK, to give birth to a baby, as a previous child died owing to the barbaric conditions of Isis. She is totally unrepentant and, from the short interview that she gave to the BBC (who have become anti-British in attitude) it is clear that she still believes in Isis and, no doubt, bring up her child as a terrorist. It's unbelievable that we are even considering this to happen when Britons have died, in their own country (7/7, the Manchester bombings, etc.) as a result of fundamentalist Muslims, some home-grown and some refugees from their war-torn countries deciding that we should be punished for not following their versions of Islam. If she is not denied access to return and stripped of her citizenships, then the UK will have signed its own death warrant. It won't have been because the average Briton has some kind of death wish, it will be because the liberal, middle-class pc element are blind to the evil that results from refusing to accept that immigrants should follow, and adhere to, the British way of life, justice and tolerance but encourages them to follow ways of life that are an existentialist threat to Great Britain and Her Majesty the Queen's subjects.
This not some hypothetical danger, it is very real and we ignore it at our peril.
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Jim D.
Philip, there is a world of difference between not breaking laws and ignoring the breaking of laws. To answer your Latin question of "who watches the watchers", it should be our regular law enforcement community. I have no doubt that there are sub-cultures that want to establish there own way of life. That's fine as long as it does not run contrary to our laws. If it is determined members of these cultures are breaking our laws, the ones on the books, then it is the obligation of law enforcement and the court system to do their duty, which does not include pandering for the purposes of political correctness.
My views on this subject are not specific to the Muslim community. They apply equally to all cultures that want to come to America, hopefully for the purpose of making a better life for themselves in a free society. Abiding by the law is not an option. Crying racism when you are arrested for committing an illegal act in America that is accepted in whichever country you come from is not an option. Isolating yourselves in your own little community and thinking you can do whatever you want is not an option. I'm not suggesting you have to abandon your culture completely, but you do have to assimilate a little, at least enough to function in our society. If you can't do that, then I think it best you go back the the country from which you emigrated.
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Philip Ryan
Jim. for decades now, Pakistani Muslims have been breaking the law and the police, local authorities etc, have turned a blind eye to gangs of Pakistanis grooming and raping underage girls, all for political correctness. Baroness Warsi ( ennobled by a government wishing to prove their pc credentials) stated as a matter of fact that Muslim counter cultures were established in the UK and followed Sharia law. From Tony Blair onwards, both Labour and Conservative governments did nothing about flourishing Muslim cultures, based upon the norms of their countries of origin, indeed, they encouraged it and refused to insist that immigrants assimilated. What is more, any person who challenged this were called racists and dinosaurs and intolerant. Nowadays, to call yourself English is to risk being automatically racist, with no tolerance shown to their viewpoint; in fact, no-one even wants to listen to their views. It is interesting to note that the Irish have moved to Great Britain for centuries and they assimilate immediately; within a generation, their accents are lost and only their name gives a clue to their heritage. That is what true assimilation looks like and they don't have to be asked to do so, they do it naturally. Governments refused to insist that all immigrants to so and decided that we should become multicultural, without the consent of native citizens, and what has been the result? In London, some areas have graffiti such as Whites Out, Whites Not Allowed, This is a Yemeni area. In Scotland, Pakistani gangs murdered white Scots, yet this was not mentioned on the BBC for fear of causing a backlash. This is where multiculturalism ends up. Just read about Shamima Begum, a British national who ran away to join Isis and now wants to return to give birth, as her two previous babies died because of the primitive conditions that Isis provided. Now Muslims insist that we should allow her return to protect her human rights, although she is now fully radicalised and firmly believes in Isis still. This is madness, but no-one dares to question it. No-one is prepared to make a stand and double standards now prevail at the expense of our way of life. I do not object to other races, or religions, but when we have areas of the country where Diwali is celebrated, but not Christmas, I am very concerned. In my childhood, you would hear the church bells ringing to call the faithful to prayer; those bells have now fallen silent. I do not want to wake up one day and hear a Muslim call to prayer from one of the many mosques now springing up throughout the country. Yet I am made to feel guilty about wanting to remain a Christian in a Christian country and risk being branded racist and Islamophobic. Please answer me this; am I racist for wanting to keep the culture in which I was brought up?
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Don
Just one issue with your comment (the rest was spot on):
"wanting to remain a Christian in a Christian country"
A Christian country? Where do you reside? I ask because the U.S. is most definitively NOT a Christian nation. We are a secular Democratic Republic, our Founders made certain of that.
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Jim D.
Philip, I think you are making my argument for me. I will go back to my very first post on this subject: If they are not breaking any laws, then there is no problem.
All the examples you gave involve sub-cultures breaking the law, and law enforcement and government ignoring it. That's a huge problem.
People of all religions and cultures must be treated equally under the law. It is also true that law-breakers must be treated equally under the law. All citizens are entitled to due process.
We must never be afraid to enforce the law and prosecute the offenders. There are no exceptions.
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Philip Ryan
Don, I live in the UK. From Anglo-Saxon times, it has been a Christian country and from Henry VIII's reign onwards the monarch has held the title Defender of the Faith; something that the monarchs took seriously. Religious Education was a mandatory lesson, which was purely Christian and at the start of school, assemblies were held daily that commenced with the singing of a hymn.
The majority of pupils were not interested in religion, nor were their parents, but it was an accepted tradition; no-one saw it as indoctrination and no-one objected, although parents could withdraw their children from religious education, it was unheard of. Nobody was at all bothered by it, least of all atheists.
With a progressive secularisation of Christian schools and relaxation of educational laws, the UK has seen madrassa schools and gurdwara schools being set up, which strictly enforce their respective religious laws and cultural norms and religious education in mainstream schools covers all religions, with Christianity as almost an afterthought.
There is a positive encouragement of counter-cultures, who do not hold these liberal views and the politically-correct call themselves progressive because they see multi-culturalism as so important, whilst denigrating traditional values and norms of the UK.
The upshot of giving other cultures free reign has been to see further racial tensions as the divergence between these various groups develops and their intolerance of British values and way of life seems to be the only unifying factor between them. The more freedoms they are given, the more demanding and intolerant they become, to the stage that to walk around some parts of this country is to feel as if you are in another country, where your presence is not wanted.
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Don
"from Anglo-Saxon times" Not quite - the original Anglo-Saxons were pagans, and many died rather than convert.
"no-one saw it as indoctrination" Sure, and slavery wasn't considered wrong at one time. But it is, and what you described is a classic definition of indoctrination.
"Nobody was at all bothered by it, least of all atheists." Oh PLEASE! If you really believe that, I have some beachfront property in Arizona to sell you. Atheists are beaten and killed TODAY for speaking out. You really think any of them were stupid enough to paint a target on themselves and their families?
And lastly, don't blame the influx of other cultures on "secularization", as history shows us the opposite. Sorry the tyrannical Christian stranglehold on your country no longer exists. As the old saying goes - evolve or die.
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Philip Ryan
Jim The trouble is that exceptions have been made consistently and regularly, with Muslims being particularly deferred to. Despite Pakistani Muslim taxi drivers having raped schoolgirls for over a decade, with knowledge of these activities having been known of by the police and other authorities, no action was taken in the interests of racial harmony. These are not one-off incidents, it has been a recognised pattern, but the victims came from broken homes and nobody cared about them. You are right, there should be no exceptions; the reality is that allowances keep getting made because of their 'cultural' differences. Rather than being encouraged to assimilate, UK citizens are told to accept their cultures, or risk getting convicted for a race hate crime. The result is that we have had terrorist bombings at the hands of homegrown radicalised terrorists and no-one will admit to how we got to this state of affairs.
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John Owens
Our opinions on the things you have stated are pretty much the same, Jim D.
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pcfield
It is true...as I stated before it is already happening here in the small towns Obama sent them all and for sure in the bigger cities with larger neighborhoods. The goal of Islam is to rule the whole world with Sharia Law by any means; as most religions want to do in their own ways...look at the history of the Catholic Church and all the atrocities and denominations it has spawned...all for one truth adulterated for power and money. So sad...
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Stoodie Baker
Except, I believe they are guilty of impersonation. It's no mere coincidence that their shield insignia looks exactly like the NYPD shield, or that their patrol cars are dead ringers for NYPD cars, right down to the letter sizing and font used. Additionally, their cars have flashing blue and red lights. They don't outright identify themselves as a police force, but the similarities are too numerous to be coincidental. These are uniformed people policing neighborhoods to keep them safe for a specific group of people. This isn't like Guardian Angels or any other altruistic watch groups. They aren't interested in anyone other than themselves.
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Gerardo
Let’s create, then, the White People Patrol, the Atheist Americans Police, The Black Citizens Vigilates, etc. This is absurd and the beginning of bad things to come. As Americans everyone is equal under the law and this custom-made griups have no reason to be. What are their functions pray tell. To verify that women wear a hijab or that little Abdullah is not having an ice cream during Ramadan? I worked for many years in the Middle East and know First hand the abuses and bigotry of the Mutawwa, the religious police. Let’s keep America free. No to these vigilantes!
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Ralph J Miller
They come to this country,start their own police force to protect themselves from who? Other Muslims or Americans?
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Carl Elfstrom
Many Muslims are Americans, and many of their families and ancestors have been Americans for generations. There's no them versus us with this group of concerned American citizens. They are us. Many different religions are represented in this country by Americans, both native of this land, and not. And there have always been neighborhood communities within our communities made up primarily of people of the same ethnicity, and social and religious groups, who would probably feel safer being watched or policed by there own kind, than by outsiders.
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Tom
Based on EEOC guidelines it is illegal to hire or refuse to hire based on race, religion, ethnicity, gender... And so on. They are in violation plain and simple. NYC is facing a hefty lawsuit as soon as someone is rejected or worse someone gets hurt and they can articulate that the harm was a result of religious/ethics differences. It's just a morally and legally dumb idea. They already have muslims in the legit NYPD anyway.
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AK Coniferious
you do realize they are volunteers, as in not getting paid, not hired, right?
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Tom
That's so cool. I guess now I can finally start up my all Caucasian Community Patrol... What's that? That would be racist? Hmmmm... Double standard
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Lionheart
That’s an excellent idea Tom, I like how you think.
Taking your idea, and knowing atheists could be persecuted in Muslim and other religious communities, an Atheist Community Patrol could be established to safeguard their welfare.
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Carl Elfstrom
Some Caucasians already tried that,Tom. I think they call it the KKK. It hasn't worked out like it was originally planned. Outside of the additional assistance needed in ethnic and religious ghettos, it seems better that we all come together as one, and identify simply as Americans. I hope that doesn't sound too Republican for you.
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Tom
Thank you Carl for making my point for me. And it doesn't sound Republican at all to me. I can't even think of how that sounds political one way or the other but maybe you're a genious or something.
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Travis Wilbur
Not sure I can fully support this.
While I can agree with a group acting as a PROTECTIVE force, defending people of a particular ethnicity or theo-political group from violence or predation, the big problem lies in an organized "police" force made up of people from only one demographic. You risk them going from merely defending people to utilizing your perceived "authority" to enforce and impose the tenets of your religion on other people. This bears the mark of a religion being supported by government, a clear violation of the First Amendment of the United States Constitution and Bill of Rights.
If anyone starts getting harassed by these self-imposed "police officers" for owning a dog, not wearing the right clothes, eating certain foods, or not declaring a belief in a specific deity, then we're gonna have a real problem.
This is why we have normal police and the Second Amendment. An organized group like this should be made up of equal parts of people from a wide variety of genders, ethic groups, and religions (or lack thereof), and not relegated to patrons of one specific creed..
A Muslim Police Force is just as viable as a Christian Police Force, an Atheist Police Force, or a Satanist Police Force.
A Muslim Police Force is a recipe for disaster, waiting to happen.
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Carl Elfstrom
I'm glad we have concerned U.S. citizens, from wherever they and their ancestors came from, and regardless of their religious beliefs, who care enough about the welfare of others to take an active part in assisting the police, however they can. That shows a lot more than good citizenship, and also is quite an expression of American Patriotism. We don't know the future, and the failures of similar groups in other countries has nothing to do with what's going on with this group, in the present moment. Hopefully, they are aware of those groups who failed in such endeavors, and will seek to avoid making such mistakes. Only time will tell. For now, my hat's off to them, and I wish them well.
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Tom B
Respectfully; when the "laws" of "organized religions" conflict with secular laws, the secular laws should control; 100% of the time...Peace...Tom
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John Owens
The Muslims seem to be receiving a lot more open-mindedness over this than Briarwood Presbyterian did when they started their own security patrols in a previous article.
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S
So then should we have a Christian group like this for one example? Because I know for sure in some areas a Christian patrol car like this would be attacked on the streets by what some people call peaceful Muslims.
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The Rev. Dr. Marion Ceruti
In theory nothing is wrong with that. If you allow one watch group, you have to allow all religions to have their own watch groups. Main thing is that they need to comply with existing civil law. Rent-a-cops also need to be included here, as well as volunteer groups. Not bad in theory, but their behavior is what needs to determine whether they are legit.
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Tara
This is so wrong. This is giving an open door for Muslims to impose their agenda on citizens of this country. NYC has succumbed to Muslim terrorism and is proving it by doing this. This protects potential terrorists by giving them the guise of law enforcement. The ONLY law that should be enforced is American law - no sharia law should be permitted at all. It is the assault on the freedoms of every American. This is an offense to every American and to every other religion out there. People should be extremely wary and should demand that this be disbanded and stopped. It is a complete embracing of one doctrine by a municipality. Wrong in every sense of the word. If this is allowed, then they MUST develop an All Christian division, an All Jewish division, an All Agnostic Division, an All Hindu division, an All Shaker division, and a division for absolutely EVERY religion or doctrine out there!
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Thom
placating to a group is dangerous. It further divides us.
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Preacher Man
They're nothing but vigilantes in a make believe squad car. We have real police officers to keep the peace. Sharia law is not recognized in this country for good reason. We don't need a "religious patrol".
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Bob Anderson
Read the Quran..it's all there. Slowly, but surely, acquire power positions in a non-Muslim community or country and infiltrate its power base...school boards, city counsels, superintendent positions, etc. Before long, you are in a position to take over and can restrict access to Muslim areas, impose Sharia law, and impose Islamic restrictions first in the county, then the State. Recent Congressional elections have demonstrated the success of their efforts...and the truth of this claim is shown by the elected Muslim's almost immediate attack on Israel. Read the Quran. Until you do, don't give me this "living peacefully together". Islam is anything but peaceful. And calling me a bigot or racist won't change the facts.
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Rev Dr Ryan
It's happening in the UK. Follow the link below, which is a government report into Sharia Law being operated here, and you can read between the lines that it's use is recognised and the government is powerless to stop Muslims following Sharia Law. The report is a whitewash and it was even boycotted by women's rights groups (see the annexes to read their reasons why they refused to take part - basically down to Human Rights abuses), yet it recognises that the government doesn't even know how many Sharia Law courts are operating here.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/678478/6.4152_HO_CPFG_Report_into_Sharia_Law_in_the_UK_WEB.pdf
Some towns and cities are now majority Muslim and they refuse to integrate - some can't even speak English (and don't want to learn) and successive governments have even encouraged them to remain separate, rather than integrate. There are even Muslim only schools and others where the governors have been taken over by fundamentalist Muslims, something that they have been instructed to do, so that they can take control.
This is a gradual takeover, bit by bit, until they have completely taken over. Anyone who is not a Muslim, or who doesn't follow the strict requirements of Islam are at risk, their idea of justice is brutal, primitive and barbaric. When Muslim communities start 'helping out', they have just one aim: to take control. If you go to some cities, it's like visiting another country and that's what happens when they are given freedom by governments to do as they will.
Don't allow them to start policing, it's the thin end of the wedge.
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Jack Mabry
Last I heard, NYPD does a pretty good job of protecting everyone in NY. If this isn't racist, what the heck is?
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Milton
Muslims are not a race, they are a religious group.
What ever happened to separation of church and state?
Is this a progressive religious police force specifically for policing the radicals of their religion?
While we're at it, let's also have a Scientology Police, Mormon Police, Flying Spaghetti Monster Police, Pink Unicorn Police, and P.C. Police (oh wait we have that one)?
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Minister Bill
I have one question to pose to this forum. Given that Europeans and Americans are supposed to be PC and "tolerant" to a cult of hate and world wide conquest, that includes barbarity towards women, death to gays, possession of slaves, "marriages" to children, rape of young boys while at the same time contradictory killing other gays but just not the ones that have sex with male children, that imposes their cult of death tenants and so called religion on us, or else their Koran tells them to kill us if we will not convert, that expects us to accept female denigrating muslim garb,.......brings me to this question. What do we think (know without any doubt) would happen to anyone who wore this Universal Life Church's minister's clothing (picture from ULC's site here)https://ecp.yusercontent.com/mail?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgallery.mailchimp.com%2F37ea977745f8b35fbc9b8ee93%2Fimages%2F83faf1e8-c212-4643-ab6a-c5f137934169.jpg&t=1550726189&ymreqid=1be378d5-856a-beb3-1c56-35000e013b00&sig=.DMUNLOGyk.iJ4xLTApY0Q--~C in Muslim dominated Deerborn Michigan? Would they be attacked by the same muslims who tell us we should be tolerant of their middle eastern manner of dress.
Personally I believe the person wearing this Catholic looking priest costume, would be lucky to get away from an angry mob of Islamists with their life. What do you think?
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Bob Anderson
Minister Bill---I think...no, I KNOW you're right. Islam is an intolerant and violent 'religion'. Its values are the antithesis of modern culture and values. Before you reply, just read the basic tenets as stated in the Quran (Koran). It's all there in black and white. Ignore it at your peril.
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The Rev. Dr. Marion Ceruti
Fortunately, many Muslims are not Islamists and do not follow every word of the Koran literally. The Sufi sects are a case in point. Sufis do not attack others on the basis of their beliefs. The Sufis themselves were the target of violent attacks in the middle East. We should judge everyone by their behavior and what they produce. We cannot assume that every Muslim wants to kill everyone who is not in their sect if Islam. Having said that, we cannot let down our guard because we know that Islamists and radical terrorists do want to kill us.
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Bob Anderson
The Sufi's are a poor example as they have never been a part of the Islamic mainstream. However, one point is absolutely true; because the Sufi's didn't accept the Quran as absolute dogma, they were persecuted by the vast majority of Muslims. No, "we cannot assume that every Muslim wants to kill everyone not in their sect of Islam". But the vast majority consider doing just that as their religious duty, and those sects are the one's immigrating to the EU and the U.S. And before you start making assimptions, I am a progressive liberal.But I'm also not blind and deaf.
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Secretary3rd
Do they practice their religion while on duty as a private security patrol. They will learn that they have become targets by every hooker, their pimps, every gay person, ever other religion who want to throw rocks at them. Looking and driving cars that look like NYC police is putting a target on themselves. If they decide to enforce their beliefs on Muslim women it could be deadly for them. I say that they want to stand out as a Muslim security patrol then look as different from the NYC police as you can.
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Robert Messmer
Quote: "Nevertheless, it’s easy to understand why the Muslim community feels a need to look out for each other. New York City is home to roughly 22 percent of America’s Muslim population, and authorities recorded 32 hate crime incidents in the city during the 2018 calendar year alone." New York City has a population of 8.6+ million (2017) with 101,716 major felonies (murder and manslaughter, rape, assault, robbery, burglary, grand larceny, and car thefts-2016) just to give some perspective to the alleged 32 hate crimes. A question not answered in the article was all 32 of the alleged hate crimes committed against Muslims or is that the total for hate crimes? Also were all of them investigated and found to be actual hates crimes or were some of them smolletts?
https://www.bing.com/search?q=population+of+new+york+city&form=EDNTHT&mkt=en-us&httpsmsn=1&refig=4c380ed2dbc34cbaf8b85fd0255d431e&PC=DCTS&sp=1&qs=LS&pq=population+of+new+&sc=8-18&cvid=4c380ed2dbc34cbaf8b85fd0255d431e&cc=US&setlang=en-US
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/27/nyregion/new-york-city-crime-2017.html
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John Owens
The arabic writing on the left rear quarter-panel-- LOL!
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Bob Anderson
You just can't leave it at that, John...what does it say?
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Daniel
The duty of a Police/Peace officer is to serve and protect the community. There are numerous cases where the unchecked use of that authority has led to prejudice, racism, excessive use of force, murder, etc. This is where communities have organized groups to serve and protect segments of society that have been unjustly marginalized or who have otherwise suffered abuse/neglect. As others have noted, there are Jewish patrols and other groups too. A muslim volunteer patrol should not be unequally favored or disfavored. Even so, in the same way regular police can go astray when the checks and balances and oversight break dow, the same is true for these volunteer public servants. The simple answer is for New York and other governing authorities to enact policies that provide adequate oversight and accountability for ONLY assisting the police with non-secular interventions under the civil standards for the whole community; and they could do more of the same for the regular police as well.
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Milanko Djurdjulov
This is the United States of America. Wake up, you who are a sleep. History has already spoken and is clear for those who have ears to hear. I am afraid to say if we continue down this road of freedom without responsibility, along with all the negative attributes of the Devil himself, this Great Country will fall, and great will be the fall. Thy will be done and lead us not into temptation one language, one people, under God indivisible with Liberty and Justice for all. Then and only then will be truly United. Ministry of Milanko Djurdjulov.
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Don
Gods and devils are imaginary. Best to worry about the real world. It's in a real mess thanks to the religious.
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Bob Anderson
Religion is a cancer and infects everything it touches.
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"For Ali, the idea that anyone would reward hate crimes...was downright frightening"
So, does he protest the Muslims in Yemen and Gaza for rewarding hate crimes against Jewish people?
Or is he a hypocrite?
They should disband immediately. Its bad enough we a terrorist in Congress. Omar is as deceitful as they come.
If they are working with the authorities for a peaceful and safe community no one should interfere. No different than the Patriot Guard volunteers working to protect military families from all the protesters and such.
Community watch groups have existed for years. Although most don't have easily identifiable vehicles. I can't see interfering based on the assumption they may do something wrong. Not the American way. However, if laws are broken we do have a legal system in place for that.
The United States canNOT have political groups (and Islam is political) setting up their own police groups. The fact is that they have no authority to do this. This is America, and people living here must abide by our rules of law.
I totally agree with you
The Jews have been doing this in NY for decades, including their own ambulance service which will leave injured non-Jews to suffer in the street. No is allowed to complain about that, though.
Impersonating an officer is against the law
Nice job naming 2 of the most oppressed regions on the planet right now. Gaza being oppressed by Israel and Yemen being oppressed by Saudi Arabia while the US backs them both. Its appaling that you would lick shots at people currently enduring deep oppression, poverty, and death. Stop punching down on people to score cheap political shots.
Travis...please leave your cherry-picked moralizing to the the Islamic propaganda machine. The terrorists in both Yemen and Gaza depend upon bleating sheep like you to further maintain their claims of victim hood. Stop punching down on people currently defending their countries against terrorist attacks to score cheap political shots.
Ah yes, those poor squatters in Gaza, who SHOULD have gone home after their allies failed to, in their own words "push the Jews into the sea". They stayed and have done nothing but incite violence for the past 7 decades. Name one non-Muslim organization that issues reward money to families of suicide bombers. Just one will do. I'll wait...