If Alabama State Rep. Rolanda Hollis has her way, men in her home state will get a curious 50th birthday present: a mandatory vasectomy.
The text of HB 238 minces no words and leaves little room for confusion:
A man, at his own expense, shall undergo a vasectomy within one month of his 50th birthday or the birth of his third biological child, whichever comes first.
Obviously, the bill has little chance of being passed. So what does Rep. Hollis hope to accomplish here?
Protest Bill
The mandatory vasectomy bill, which Rep. Hollis is calling a “family planning” bill, is a direct response to Alabama’s restrictive anti-abortion laws, particularly the Alabama Human Life Protection Act, which would ban abortion in nearly all circumstances, including rape and incest, and would make performing an abortion a felony punishable by a maximum sentence of life in prison. That bill passed the Alabama House and Senate and was signed into law by Governor Kay Ivey in 2019, but implementation has been delayed by legal challenges.
So, Rep. Hollis submitted her own reproductive bill, putting the onus on men to make some mandatory family planning steps.
While few expect the bill to become actual law, the Birmingham representative has been clear her sole intention was to challenge the thinking behind her state's sweeping anti-abortion legislation. "The vasectomy bill is to help with the reproductive system. This is to neutralize the abortion ban bill. The responsibility is not always on the women. It takes 2 to tangle. This will help prevent pregnancy as well as abortion of unwanted children."
But it is clear the bill is only meant to make a point, and not to be taken as a serious proposal. As Rep. Hollis says, she only introduced the bill to send the message that “men should not be legislating what women do with their bodies.”
A Deferens of Opinion
Hollis' main argument is that legislating the human body as a viable solution to problems like abortion and unplanned pregnancy would be considered unnecessarily controlling (perhaps even a human rights violation) if applied to men. As HB 238 notes, “under existing law, there are no restrictions on the reproductive rights of men.”
But other politicians disagree. Texas Senator Ted Cruz tweeted his opposition to the bill:
Rep. Hollis is hardly the first lawmaker to propose regulating men’s bodies to make a point about reproductive freedom. Last year, Georgia State Representative Dar’Shun Kendrick wrote a “testicular bill of rights” in response to her own state’s abortion bill, which sought to ban abortion after six weeks, before many women even know they’re pregnant. Rep. Kendrick’s bill sought to ban vasectomies, require paternity tests at the sixth week of pregnancy (and require immediate child support payments if positive), and would require a mandatory 24-hour waiting period for men looking to purchase pornography or sex toys.
Will It Work?
The goal of these bills is not, of course, to actually mandate (or ban) vasectomies. Nobody earnestly wants to force men to get a vasectomy on their 50th birthday. The goal, rather, is to draw comparisons between these restrictive bills targeting men, and the seemingly neverending abortion bills that seem to get more restrictive year after year.
To that end, will these political stunts truly wring any empathy out of the (majority male) conservative lawmakers in these states? Perhaps framing the debate in terms men are more able to relate to - having their reproductive rights arbitrarily restricted by the state legislature - might help.
Or does a sham bill only play into the idea that Democrats don’t take the pro-life position very seriously at all?
73 comments
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Minister Carlos Ricardo Walls
Are we living in a communist country?I'm quite sure there are alternative measures.Eg:condoms,abstinence,etc.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
It sounds to me like away to help make sure Alabama isn't overpopulated, and they've got enough wierdos living there already, so it doesn't bother me at all.
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David A Griffith
The first thing that men start commenting on is how crazy the woman is for suggesting such a thing. The Trumpites start going crazy about communism and degrading the woman who wrote the bill.
Nothing about a woman’s right to choose or the part the man plays in why a woman has to choose. What about the couple who both agree an abortion is the correct choice for them, there is no choice in many places.
It is time to get your heads out of the sand, move forward into the future, progress. Why is it that every idea that is good and moves a society to a higher place is fought tooth and nail by the religious?
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CB
There are those who are actively trying to promote communism, which does not work, in the United States.
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Carl Bernard Elfstrom
One good thing about it is a lot of young women only want to have fun with older men, without having to worry about those Grandpa's getting them pregnant and marrying them, just so they'll get free nursing care in their old age.
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Ilmenheru Terikson
Friend of mine recently got a vasectomy after his wife got preggers with number 3. It got around his work place ofcourse and says suddenly young women working there are coming around him and being flirtatious like never before. Clearly the idea of having a man with zero risk of babies appeals to smart young women.
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Paul J. Fumero
No these are the crazed and evil evangelicals working for the Devil. I propose we start with the guy and unse no pain killers. I think he is not fit to reproduce in any capacity.
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Reverend Bob
In my thirties, right after my third son was born, I got a vasectomy. Amazingly, I’ve never gotten anyone pregnant since then! No one since wanted an abortion because of me. It’s rather empowering to have control over one’s own body. What a concept for both men and women...control over one’s own body ...
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Daniel Gray
And I guess you didnt read the story as it does not allow both sexes, it only penalizes one. And for that it is illegal and wont even be considered in committee.
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Reverend Bob
Daniel, It turns out I did read the article. I loved the irony of it! I love how Ms. Hollis, in jest, promotes a one sided view that absolutely prohibits choice for men in her state. Surely you understand how many feel regarding the sense of lost personal liberty in government mandated abortion legislation by several states. I love the enraged reactions upon mandating rules that do not fit the personal beliefs of many men. To me, it levels the so-called moral playing field a bit. In my humble opinion, whether you conceive 15 children or whether you choose an abortion for personal reasons, it comes down to choice. Choice reflects personal, thoughtful dialog with one's self or with one's god (assuming a god is part of one's personal identity). Choice is a responsibility and a privilege, not just a random, fleeting thought. Back to my part in my having a vasectomy...I procreated! I co-created! And now, after the snip, I'm free to enjoy myself and my relationships responsibly without harm or shame that so haunts our society. Choice, my friend, has a place with all of us! Of course, it is fine by me if you disagree.
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Daniel Gray
Oh believe me, I know the woman as she lives next door to my great grandmother. and she is not doing this in jest. To try and put forth a bill and to do it as a joke or in jest in the Alabama legislature is a sure way for you to be censored and be banned from putting forth any bills or supporting any bills for two weeks for a first offense. They, unlike the national Congress; dont take this as a joke or expect you to do so either.
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Ilmenheru Terikson
Ah your family hails from alabama. Well that explains everything wrong with you and your posts right there;)
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Minister Mike
Wouldn't it be a hoot if the bill passed and was signed into law? 😂😂😂😂😂
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Reverend Bob
Especially if it's only Alabama!
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Minister Mike
Why only Alabama?
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Master Wolf KSC
The point is that women are having use of their own God-given bodies legislated by mostly-male, mostly-GOP legislators. Fair-play to have equally outrageous legislation for men’s’ bodies. Why would one of these legislative moves be ok but the other outrageous to people? Judging from most of the comments here, it seems like we are far from equality.
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DRREVHANNAHHOPE GORDON
So true,Master Wolf KSC
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Bryon Ivy
WOW! This woman needs prayer! The devil has a Strong hold in Congress. The Democratic Party is the Terrorist Organization in this country. I agree with Minister Walls, I to am quite sure there are alternative measures !! IE: Condoms,abstinence. etc. Not to mention birth control for women.
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CB
I agree!
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DRREVHANNAHHOPE GORDON
WHY DOES SHE NEED PRAYER?
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Lionheart
I am surprised the Judeo Christian God didn’t include vasectomies as one of his commandments being as he seems to have some very strange practices for mankind such as removing foreskins from little baby boys. It’s amazing to think that an omnipotent God who is supposed to have created the universe and all that is contained within the cosmos over billions and billions of years has time to think about something so stupid as circumcision. But anyway, I am sure that vasectomies would have his approval being as he has a thing about genitals, incest, spilling seed, virgin birth etc. It would be right up his alley!
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CB
LOL! So many secular concepts have been cloaked in religious edicts!
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Daniel Gray
still attacking others religions I see Lionheart
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Lionheart
No, just attacking mythical gods. I’m sure yours is real.....right?
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Daniel Gray
No you are just showing yourself as my grandmother would say as you can no more prove that the God of the Bible isnt real then anyone can prove your chosen God is real. There is no need to be a child about it and constantly attack another's beliefs.
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Lionheart
I don’t have a chosen god, and why would I if none of them have the ability to prove themselves to us that they exist?
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Ilmenheru Terikson
In any debate one has to be able to offer substantiated proof of any facts presented. one does not need to offer proof of no god to instantly invalidate any attempted debate using a gods existence as justification or a position to argue from.
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CB
Lionheart has made some good points! Ideally an individual will develop a set of ethics, values and moral standards regarding how he or she conducts their life. Many of the traditions we might call "religious" and/or "spiritual" are co-opted into cultural social control mechanisms of how individuals behave. Much of the time the true origins and reasons those traditions came about is either purposefully concealed, as can be seen by the lack of true education in the public school system in use today; basic history is no longer being taught, for example, and many United States citizens have no idea of what the Constitution says. Whether or not to have a vasectomy is one of the most personal decisions a man can make; one would think that would be his decision; not the State's.
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Daniel Gray
And yet CB in most of the states a doctor will not do a vasectomy on a male unless he has his wife's or girlfriends permission (six of my sisters and nieces are all nurses and two of my nephews are doctors so I do know what I am speaking of) and yet a woman can have an abortion without the males consent. Now tell me CB exactly how that is fair or even should be legal?
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CB
Wow! Did not know that - thank you for providing the information! I see your point; it is a good one. However, one has to be careful in comparing the procedures; vasectomy and abortion. The parallel to the vasectomy is the sterilization procedure for the woman; cutting out a section of the Fallopian tube and cauterizing the ends so they do not re-attach. Now on that procedure, in many states, it is a difficult one for many women to have performed; she, too, has to prove she has either A)had all the children she desires and/or B) provide some sort of proof that she will never desire to have children - it is actually somewhat similar to the process a man has to go through, according to your description - to get a vasectomey.
The other thing for us to consider is personal responsibility. For example, in many states, if a woman has a child and can prove that a particular man is the father, she can sue him for some sort of financial support, even if they were not married at the time of the birth of the child.
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Daniel Gray
And this is my point exactly. Why should it be that a woman can kill a fetus if the man wants the child and is more then willing to assume all legal responsibility for the child, and yet if she wants the child and the man does not then she can go ahead and have the child and force the man to assume legal responsibility.
The way it should be is if she does not want the child and can have an abortion to get rid of it, then fine. But if she gets pregnant and the man does not want the child then he should not have to assume financial or legal responsibility for the child. And at neither time should they be able to come and get ADC or welfare for the child as if they could not afford the child then they should have kept it in his pants and her legs closed.
Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
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Anna Brown
CB - please see my comment below. Please practice a bit of skepticism. Think twice about the proposal. "in most of the states a doctor will not do a vasectomy on a male unless he has his wife's or girlfriends permission" . Does that sound reasonable to you??? The answer here is NO! Please do some research before just accepting an assertion without any proof. BTW - stories from relatives don't count as proof.
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Anna Brown
"in most of the states a doctor will not do a vasectomy on a male unless he has his wife's or girlfriends permission" - citation needed please. At what time in our country's history is/was this true? I can see where a DR may ask a man if he has discussed his decision with his partner but to need permission from a wife or girlfriend is just unbelievable. Citation needed.
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The Rev. Dr. Marion Ceruti
Unfortunately, many truths are being concealed purposely, especially in the schools where young mind are very impressionable. This borders on child abuse. One reason why cursive writing is not taught in the schools now is because the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Bill of Rights are all written in cursive writing. Thus, if you don't know how to read it, you will not be able to tell if a "transcription" is correct or a fraud. It is a shame that a whole generation of Americans will not know how to sign their names correctly and read cursive writing. I have found it very helpful to be able to recognize who wrote something by their handwriting even if they nave not signed their name. (Comes in handy when doing genealogy and family history.)
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Tom
Marion...you write a very interesting point...more and more individual expression, and the understanding of others, is being actively deleted in the schools and life...technology is striving to reach the point of management of people, by keeping them entertained...we are rapidly losing respect and meaningful interaction and understanding of others...sad...Peace...Tom B
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CB
Yes, Marion and Tom, you are so right! Thank you for the information as to the main reason why cursive reading and writing are now not taught; makes sense, what with the globalists trying to take over the whole world, and their attempts to eradicate anyone from having any sort of relationship with the Divine.
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Rod Gesner
Baa BAAA BLEET Listen to the Sheep; The Do not read or understand They Just REact and Condemn the Woman..
She was Making a Point about HOW Wrong it is for One Sex; to Make Laws over the Bodies and Choices of The OTHER Sex... Try to READ PAST the Headlines folks n You Might learn Something New???
of course there is No New Knowledge for The WILLFULLY IGNORANT
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Reverend Bob
Well bleeted, Mr Gesner...Well bleeted indeed!
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Richard Lee Cornell
Good it will open the eyes of those State men that if women can not control their bodies then maybe men will not have a option either.
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DRREVHANNAHHOPE GORDON
So true, I'm so amazed, that this is so no apparent, and you're the only one that commented on this Good for you. God bless. Rev. HeidiAnnne Leon
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Bryon Ivy
WOW! This woman needs prayer! The devil has a Strong hold in Congress. The Democratic Party is the Terrorist Organization in this country. I agree with Minister Walls, I to am quite sure there are alternative measures !! IE: Condoms,abstinence. etc. Not to mention birth control for women.
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Minister Mike
Considering the bill was introduced as a comment on the state's restrictive abortion law(s), what say you about abortion?
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Anna Brown
Bryon Ivy - LOL! at first I was upset by your comment and then I realized it was pure sarcasm. No one could really take what you said on face value.
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CB
I can understand the desire to bring attention to what many would regard as the extreme legislation regarding abortion by submitting an extreme bill for men. I get it. However, it is rather sad that it seems to take rather over-the-top theatrics to bring attention to pressing issues, especially in light of something that really is a pressing issue: https://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1225610404325478400
read the text of the bill here: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/5383/text
It basically tries to punish American citizens for being American citizens and allow illegal aliens to do whatever they like, and make taxpayers foot the bill for bringing criminals who have been deported back to the United States. But back to the main topic: forced vasectomies: it begs the question, just to whom does your body, whether you are a male or female, belong? And yes, how is it that men are legislating what women do with their bodies? Who owns whom and/or what? Very good points to consider, indeed! And what about abortion, anyway? When is the fetus really coming into its own? Some traditions state that once the child is born and takes its first breath. Others say that it is up to the woman. However, it must be realized that once the child is born, these so-called "post birth abortions" are actually murders.
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Pastor Xal
While in college, I learned not to further an argument with unreliable sources. This post of a Fox Entertainment network is not credible nor reliable. Fox is an extremely effective platform for the ultra Conservative (mostly religious Right). Check the "facts" as presented by Fox, go read some credible NEWS sources and compare. Using a sensational headline does not promote Truth. Of course violence breaks down societies. So do wars and allowing citizens to carry automatic weapons for "protection". I won't be clicking any random Fox clip anytime soon.
As to Communism comparison... huh??? The Dictator currently residing in the White House isn't a Communist! Is he??
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Lionheart
You’re right, he’s not, but Bernie Sanders with the initials BS, which is very apt, certainly is.
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CB
You can read the text of the bill yourself. Do your research.
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Daniel Gray
let her try (and yes it is a woman) and I can assure you that Rep. Rolanda Hollis, D-Birmingham wont be in the state legislature for very long as it will be ruled discrimination toot sweet as it does not include women having their tubes tied. She is only doing this to get attention. Sadly for her it is going to give her the wrong kind of attention and this is not going to help her chances of getting re-elected.
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Kelsie Lynn Davis
Yeah, she is doing it for attention... Attention to put on all the overly strict abortion laws.
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Kelsie Lynn Davis
Yeah, she is doing it for attention... Attention to put on all the overly strict abortion laws.
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Rodney Knight
It's just foolishness on both sides there are always alternatives to these problems they just want to make waves and rally support hey politicians if you really want to help make things easier make it easier for willing people to adopted make it easier for people to get what they need food clean water places to live make it less expensive to heat our home cook our food light our rooms buy our food get the medicine we need for our health even see a doctor
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The Rev. Dr. Marion Ceruti
Introducing an absurd bill like this is a waste of time. It has no chance of passing. It will not make anyone who is pro life suddenly become pro death. Maybe governments should get out of the abortion picture entirely - stop funding it and stop regulating it.This is a libertarian view that has some merit. To me, it is a religious issue and is best left to the faith of the individual, knowing that what goes around, comes around. Never choose to kill a child even if you can legally. No matter how right you think you are at the time, later you may regret the decision to abort. This has happened to some women and even families who funded abortions. No one talks about that aspect; most of the discussions are polarized at one extreme or the other.
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joe
Voters need to do a better job this year!
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Ealdormon Piparskeggr Robinson
The proposal looks to me to be calling attention to the disparity of legislating women's reproductive choice and not men's. That view is from a lifelong conservative (small c deliberate). Part of the conservatism I learned from my family elders and other mentors, what you do in the privacy of your intimacy is none of my damn business, so long as there is no harm.
While I hope that abortion is never chosen, I support a woman being able to obtain that medical procedure in a safe and legal environment.
My wife and I have been a couple for over 42 years and have no children, by choice. Have not used surgical means to effect that.
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Amber M. Castleman
That is wrong it should be upto the individual if he wants it or not as long as they are healthy and nothing medically wrong like cancer and things like that the government has no say the government needs to stay out of it
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Amanda Jean Biggs
Look there is to many ways to keep from getting pregnant. I for one feel that abortions should not be used as one. As far as rape,as soon as it happens get to the hospital they can help that from happening. Don’t make a man get a vasectomy. Why can’t a women get her tubs tied. Oh and if they don’t like that idea, I don’t know why doesn’t anyone suggest birth control pills. It sounds like the feminist are trying to control men’s life. But this is my opinion for whatever it is worth.
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Anthony Ray Garbers
Not just yours. Agree 100% IF they made a pill for guys, they'd take it. Of course as the joke goes, that'd be the end of the human race waiting for a guy to want a baby. haha
But in all seriousness, there are SO many ways of preventing a pregnancy, I don't feel abortion should ever be considered one. A Woman has 100% control of her body... That said the child inside her is NOT her body.
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Dennis Wayne Starr
On this site there is a parade of Nazi's dancing down the street with a crematorium float. Maybe Alabama State Rep. Rolanda Hollis can join that parade since she does not comprehend or even like the American Constitution of the United States. I think the #Metoo with having good intent initially, has just been a focus of confusion. Because you don't think women should not be abuse in any form or matter does not necessarily equate to belief in abortion. As a older male I once thought that abortion was a woman's right of choice. Does that right choice give them right to destroy another living being? They are trying to advocate stopping a male from PRODUCING a living being to a female DESTROYING a living being. That distinction evades me. Alabama State Rep. Rolanda Hollis proposals is no different than the NAZI's desire to destroy everything and anything that did not fit their perfect ideals of their own agendas. Alabama you should be ashamed of a person with these thought representing the state even if it was in jest. How would she feel if it was directed at HER culture specifically since HER culture produces the highest level of unwed mothers and absent fathers?
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joe
No doubt this is a statement more than an actual proposal. It shows immaturity on the part of this rep. Be careful who you vote for!
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Father Phoenix
It's seriously concerning to me how many people in this thread missed the ENTIRE point of the bill and didn't read any of the information about it. On the other hand, you're proving her point by condemning her and being outraged at the concept of the bill, because that's exactly the point she's trying to make.
This bill is satirical, as an attempt to show how absurd it is for men to have to listen to a woman or the government in general dictate what they will or won't do with their reproductive health. With the sharp rise of mandatory "this" or "that" operations - or restriction of health services or operations - for women in the country recently, this bill is meant to be a mirror to that to show how ridiculous it sounds when the shoe is on the other foot.
She doesn't literally want to force men to get a vasectomy, and she's well aware that the bill has zero chance of passing. That's the point.
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Dennis Wayne Starr
Father Phoenix. I fully understand your point. It may in fact have been a parody. The problem is that many of the masses (not all of course) do not see or comprehend the difference. From that they see a representative and supposedly a responsible, albeit irresponsibly, and then transition to agreement. If you don't believe that then look at the comment below from Tabitha short comment is "Do it". Do you think anyone would believe 6 million people would be terminated ONLY for their religious beliefs. And what about the mentally challenged who were not only used as brutal experiments but, were almost disposed of as "Not useful and a burden to the state". Even TODAY there are many that claim it never happened. Are you not aware of almost daily news of those being killed for being Republican at a baseball game, Blacks killed in a church for being black and Jews killed everywhere again for unknown reasons. Hate continues. And rhetoric and satirical just promote that sometimes.
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Tabitha
Do it!!
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Simon Gregory Garner
The lawyer has it wrong, the age of the mandatory vasectomy should be 16yo and free. It would stop a plethora of unwanted pregnancies. It should then be free to reverse if and when guys want children. I've had it done after having 2 kids, one of the best decision I've ever made!
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John Damon Calloway
Looking On How This Guys & Girls Are Of This Society We Live In, I Think It Would Be Appropriate For Guys & Girls Be Limited To How Many Children They Can Have!!! Look Around, Girls Being Neighborhood Prostitutes, Guys Taking Advantage Of Girls, Of Course, The Girls Are Allowing It To Happen!!! If Your Going To Sleep And Act Like A Prostitute And Then Fail To Use Protection, Then You Should Have A Limit Or Be Required To Be Fixed Proposed On You!!!!!!
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CB
You have made some worthy points to consider.
Something else for consideration: how much of taxpayers dollars are going for raising unplanned kids? Yes, that is harsh, but it is worth thinking about. Would it not be better to educate people about birth control in the first place.
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tuppennyblue
No problem. If they want all men to have a vasectomy at 50, I'll just identify as a woman ;-)
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Reverend Bob
Best comment ever!
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Norma Battes
Yep, vasectomy at 12 years old. After 18 years old, after steady employment for 3+ years, after attending marriage and child raising training, after regular deposits into a savings account, after proof of life insurance, then you can get married and have a family.
Women, everything but the vasectomy.
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Richard Albright
Unfortunately, we pay this "politician"
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Richard Albright
Unfortunately, we pay this "politician's" salary.
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Danielle Elizabeth Ostach
The bill has no chance of being passed and I doubt she expects it to pass. She is proposing a law as intrusive and harsh on men as laws about women's rights to abortion are to women to make a very pointed statement.
The problem is that most male right wing legislators will have the whole message pass over their heads without getting a clue.
How about a law requiring lawmakers to grow a brain?
So many lawmakers are in the legislature because they crave power and they don't know what else to do. They don't seem to be good at business, science, medicine, technology, etc. It's hard to grow a brain when you insulate yourself from the people you allegedly represent. Many people who would turn out to be good lawmakers never run for office because they don't want to surround themselves with people with mental deficiencies. God has better things for them to do - a higher calling.