Discrimination is nothing new. People can be discriminated against because of their race,
gender, age, religion, or sexual orientation. It can be a very difficult thing to deal with discrimination from someone simply because of who you are. Unfortunately, those who are of a different sexual orientation have seen a lot of discrimination, to widely varying degrees. This discrimination can be due to something called homophobia, which is a fear of those who are homosexual. Like most phobias, it doesn't make much sense, but unlike most phobias, most who are homophobic tend to lash out at those in the LGBT community with hate. Sometimes it's something as simple as an offensive slur, while sometimes it is something much more extreme. Such is the case for a 54-year-old man, who was allegedly brutally murdered by two teenagers after they found out his sexual orientation.
Muslim Refugees
The man encountered the two teenagers, Muslim immigrants from Morocco, at a park. The two teenagers, aged 16 and 19, had been travelling somewhat aimlessly throughout Europe before winding up in Sweden. Once the kind man found out that the two teenagers didn't have a place to stay, he opened up his home to them so they could shower, put on some clean clothes, and get some food to eat. During their park encounter, the man was wearing a wig and was dressed as a woman, which led the two teenagers to believe that the man was female. Back at the apartment, the teenagers claim the man took off the wig and made sexual advances at them. Claiming self-defense, the 16-year-old murdered him.
Self-Defense?
While the teenagers say the crime was self-defense, it seems highly unlikely that this is the case. For one thing, the man was brutally beaten and murdered, and a dead snake was draped around his neck. This is not indicative of a self-defense case. Instead, prosecutors believe this was a hate crime. They say when the man's wig fell off, the two teenagers came to their own conclusion that the man was gay, leading them to brutally murder him.
Hate Crime
Once the man was dead, the two teenagers robbed the place. Cell phone video taken at the crime scene shortly after the victim's death had been deleted by the teenagers, but police were able to recover it.
The video shows the two teenagers throwing the victim's belongings into their backpack.
During this time, they yelled obscene profanities regarding the victim's sexual orientation at his corpse.
This hate crime has become international news, partly due to the brutality and partly because of the pure hate that these two must have had in order to commit the crime.
Murder Charges
The 16-year-old has been charged with murder while the 19-year-old has been charged with protection of a criminal, also known as obstruction of justice. Hopefully, it won't take long for it to be decided that these two are guilty of their crimes so that justice can be served.
The Hate Has to Stop
No matter what religion you are or what you believe, we must learn that it is unacceptable to hate another human being simply for who they are. We live in a sad world when a man who was trying to help some teenagers down on their luck with some simple needs like food and clean clothes is brutally murdered by those same teenagers because of his sexual orientation. Even if we disagree with each other's lifestyle, we must learn to coexist. This world is a beautiful place, but it has been made ugly by all of the hate in the world. Think of how much the world would change if we could accept people for who they are, and love them regardless of their decisions. Remember the golden rule: treat others as you would like to be treated. Is it really that hard to implement? It isn't clear whether or not the faith of the two teenagers was directly responsible for their actions, but Islam is a notoriously anti-gay religion.
No religious faith should advocate hate or violence against another group of people. The world would be such a better place if we could preach and learn to love and celebrate one another for our differences.
47 comments
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Let's all sing Kumbaya and put those idiotic "coexist" bumper stickers on our cars like they're so fond of on the left coast. As I pointed out in a previous post Muslims are bound and expected to kill homosexuals as part of their faith. All you left wingnuts here argued how wrong I was. Well, ta-da!
But I'm amused that you don't see anything a little fishy here. A 54 year old man in drag "picks up" two teens one who is 16 AND THEREFORE A MINOR and it is these two kids who are "homophobic" not the adult who is a pedophile. Bet you wouldn't be so sympathetic if the "man" were a priest and the kids alter boys!
And stop with the "homophobia" nonsense. I know many people who don't like gays. They are revolted by them, they are disgusted by their actions and they see them as sexually depraved but not one is afraid of or in any way "fears" them so the idea they are "phobic" is ridiculous.
You also termed this a "hate crime". I suggest since neither you nor any other human being knows what is in the heart of another individual the use of the inflammatory term is only your way of punishing thought you disagree with. What you term as hate may have been a youth's attempt to survive an attempted homosexual rape. They are kids after all, what the heck do they know?
Finally I ask this: Would this article have seen the light of day if the homosexual had successfully raped and murdered the two youths? The answer is no because it happens all the time and as a former police officer I've seen it. Nobody wants to report it because homosexuals are a "protected class" and kids, well, not so much. About 2,000 kids a day disappear in America. That's over 800,000 per year. There's your story, not the murder of one gay guy who may or may not have lured two kids to his apartment with promises of food and clothing.
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I agree and since being a homosexual is a choice, if they don't like how society treats them, then they can make another choice, like not being a homosexual. In addition to that with regards to hate, you can not convince me that homosexuals don't hate, that they are not homosexuals because they hate the sex they are pretending to not be, which is usually the sex they are. So don't tell me about hate because they are more full of hate then any heterosexual. and they are out there to try to recruit as many into their perverted life style as they can, that is why they advertise about being a homosexual, every time they introduce themselves to people they have to say "hi I am so and so, and I am a homosexual whatever gender they are pretending to be except their own" , that is sick.and it is a sickness.
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Mary, homosexuality is NOT a choice. And I am so sorry that the only homosexual people you have ever encountered have been full of hate (where do you meet these people?). I am bisexual and have been on this earth for over 50 years and a minister for 30 of those years.
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I am not wrong homosexuality is a choice, I talk to them and they say to me if I want to have anything to do with them and I said aren't you gay, they said yah, but it felt the same just the same that it was a mind frame, that says to me that it is a choice. And you and no body else can convince me otherwise, even my metaphysical studies have confirmed this. that is that we are born a specific sex to learn lessons they need to learn as that sex or gender and every time they come back they need to learn what they need to learn in that body. To deny yourself that experience is cheating yourself out of the experiences you were intended to have, and that is what being homosexual does. God did not make a mistake, how you interpreted God's intentions is the mistake that was made by you. that is why it is a choice.
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Mary, what can I say other than WOW. Did you re-read this before you hit the Post Comment button? "In addition to that with regards to hate, you can not convince me that homosexuals don’t hate, that they are not homosexuals because they hate the sex they are pretending to not be,which is usually the sex they are." Congratulations for not using all CAPS though!
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look i try to reread this, but sometimes my computer does not cooperate and all but freezes, i do my best with it though, and since i don't know how to make corrections if i need to, then it will have to stand as is. ad you know i do have a life and other things to interrupt my thoughts so that i sometimes do loose my train of thought. But i think what i mean to say it that they hate the opposite sex that is why so many of them will knock the opposite sex and a lot of them do not want anything to do with the opposite sex. so they stick with the sex that they are. now does that make better sense to you?
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I'm not sure where you get your information, Hoagie, as you didn't source it. Here's link that has the number of missing children in the U.S., according to the FBI, at 460,699 in 2015 and a similar number in 2014. These are certainly alarming numbers, but far short of the 800,000 you claimed. The article also notes that there are cases of multiple runaways by the same children and each incident is recorded separately, so the real numbers are smaller than indicated. http://www.missingkids.org/KeyFacts
I'm also linking an article about the teachings of Jesus (or rather the lack of them) on homosexuality. CHRISTians follow the teachings of their Saviour as laid out in the N/T, not the barbaric laws of the O/T which would land them in prison if closely followed. If you believe that Jesus condemns homosexuals, kindly provide the N/T scripture as verification. I trust you, and others who condemn homosexuality as Christians, read this brief article before responding.
http://www.wouldjesusdiscriminate.org/biblical_evidence/born_gay.html
To all Christians……. Will homosexuals who accept Jesus as their Saviour be forgiven and allowed into Heaven? Can there be LGBT folks be considered Christians?
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then stop practicing that perversions.
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A human being is simply that. Each one is unique and each life devine. It makes no difference what God or Goddess, by any name they may worship, the color of their skin, sexual orientation or age. Everyone should love their neighbor and strive to protect one another. Killing what you dislike is killing yourself. Saying someone, anyone deserves death because you don't agree with them is telling the world that you deserve the same because someone disagrees with you. Love, not hatred, is the answer, if only we would ask the right question and really listen to what we are told.
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it sure does make a difference when one form of evil tries to control others who are not or may not be evil, you damn right it makes a difference. we, the world decided Hitler was evil and needed to be stopped, and it is necessary to do it again. stop upholding them. they are barbaric and evil and they want to destroy the world as we know it to set it back to the seventh century or before Jesus came so the evil can continue to rule. and you need to stop up holding it because that kind of blindness is what aids them to keep on with their evil reign.
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Godwin’s Law is an internet adage that is derived from one of the earliest bits of Usenet wisdoms, which goes “if you mention Adolf Hitler or Nazis within a discussion thread, you’ve automatically ended whatever discussion you were taking part in.”
Hey Mary, you do realize that in the 1930's Germany was one of the most Christian countries in the world, don't you? It's very comfortable to say "the Nazis" perpetrated the Holocaust, but the reality is it was Christian Germans in collusion with, or at best, the silence of the Catholic and Protestant churches. It's scary to realize that masses of otherwise sane and moral people can be whipped into a bloodthirsty mob with the right balance of propaganda, fear and ignorance. It still works.
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NO kidding idiot, of course i know that in the 1930's the Germans were christian, they still are, did you know that, that is until the Muslims came in there. but that does not mean that Hitler was, he was Jewish and he hated the Jews and wanted to pretend he was not Jews, did you know that. I bet you didn't, or you would not had made the comment you did.
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mary… It's amazing that you have enough computer knowledge to reach this site and post, but not be able to find basic information or include references for your often preposterous claims… Here's what I found in just a couple of minutes…
The entire section on Hitler's Christianity provides ample evidence for his brand of Christianity. The evidence itself destroys any opinions or beliefs about Hitler's alleged apostasy.
The evidence shows that:
Hitler was born and baptized into Catholicism
His Jewish antisemitism came from his Christian background.
His early personal notes shows his interest in religion and Biblical views.
He believed that the Bible represented the history of mankind.
His Nazi party platform (their version of a constitution) included a section on Positive Christianity, and he never removed it.
He confessed his Christianity.
He tried to establish a united Reich German Church.
Hitler allowed the destruction of Jewish synagogues and temples, but not Christian churches.
He encouraged Nazis to worship in Christian churches.
He spoke of his Christian beliefs in his speeches and proclamations.
His contemporaries, friends, Protestant ministers and Catholics priests, including the Vatican, thought of Hitler as a Christian.
The Catholic Church never excommunicated Hitler. He died a Catholic.
To ignore the evidence of Hitler's Christianity demonstrates how power of belief can obscure the facts.
BTW, I don't think you're an idiot, mary…. Just bigoted and misinformed.
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as you said john, it was Hitlers own version of Christianity, but that did not mean that his versions should be annotated. as for his Catholics, he may had been baptized as a Catholic but that does not mean he was not the biological child of a Jewish father. did you also happen to find out that because he was a Jew boy that the man his mother was marred too beat the heck out of him everyday of his childhood because he wanted to beat the Jew out of him. this was information that was know to the German and Austrian people and so unless they published it you might find it hard to locate this info. did you also find info about how Hitler was so dilution that he thought people he meat should kiss his ring like if he were pope or something.and did you also know that he got his idea for genocide from the Muslims which he turned around and made them honorary Nazi's. it does not make Christians bad because other misuse the scriptures. it is not something that Jesus taught. just because you have a problem with Christianity for whatever warped ideas and experience you might have, it is not Christianity's fault, it is the people who missuses it. just like a person who kill another person is the person who is responsive for killing another with a gun, the gun is not at fault.
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I often browse through your comments for amusement, marysbirdworld/mary. I didn't know that Hitler was a "Jew boy" but guess that you know of many others. His father was not a Jew.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relations_between_Nazi_Germany_and_the_Arab_world
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was Hitler live divine, no, Jesus did not say you will reach heave by simply being a good human being, they, the divine beings also want us to have standards and being a homosexual has no standards. Nothing impure can enter into the kingdom of heaven because heaven is pure and it does not want it to be contaminated with the impure. that is why the being known as Satan was kicked out of heaven because they will always cause disruptions with their perverse impure ideas. And Good people would have morals and would not want others to learn or be encouraged to be or do impure things that will keep them from obtaining perfection. so i suggest to you, you reevaluate your definition of a good person.
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first of all not every body says that certain people deserve death for being perverted, secondly the people screaming some kind of unfairness because of intolerance needs to look at themselves, too as they are very intolerant themselves and more so, and that fact that somebody disagrees with them and their lifestyle does not mean you do not like them as a person and does not mean that people hate them, they just don't like what they do and what they do to society by promoting that perversion and bully people in that society into acceptance of it. They are selfish, they don't care that they are corrupting the youth and corrupting society;s values, they are only thinking of themselves. tolerance is a two way street, if the homosexuals want tolerance towards them, they need to also practice tolerance for others who do not agree with them, not agreeing does not mean you hate that person or group of people.
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Cary, thank you. There seems to be a lot of ranting on this blog and it's making me reconsider telling anyone I am a minister through ULC.
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I understand your concern Phoenix. I'm just recently back from a long hiatus due to the ranting you've noticed. There are some rational, informed and thoughtful people commenting though and you can easily scroll past the worst offenders and those USING ALL CAPS if that helps.
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John, I said the husband of Hitlers mother was not a Jew, the father of Hitler was however, as in his mother cheated on him with a Jewish guy.
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"The world would be such a better place if we could preach and learn to love and celebrate one another for our differences."
Celebrate means to publicly acknowledge a happy day or event with a social gathering or to perform a ceremony publicly or to honor or praise publicly. So I ask what part of Islam should we "celebrate"? The killing of homosexuals, the mutilation of young women, how about the stoning of adulteresses or the execution of apostates/Jews/Christians/or any non-Muslim, or the holding of slaves? Or perhaps the Muslim youths should have celebrated the older mans homosexuality by joining him in a romp through perversion-land?
No Snowflake, the world would be a better place if we had the fortitude to tell Muslims their murderous ways are unacceptable and got homosexuals the psycho-sexual help they need, not celebrate their nonsense. It used to be if you cut your wrists you were placed on suicide watch but now if you have your genitals removed you get to lead a parade. That Snowflake, is celebrating sickness, in other words defining deviancy down.
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some of the differences though are not necessarily good and it should not be celebrated, like Sharia law, that is such a barbaric inhumane law and that should not be imposed on any self respecting human, it is the ignorant who think it is good thing and they will never grow and better people if there is not demand on people to be better people then what they are being at any particular time. people tend to become complacent unless they are motivated to advance. and accepting them is saying just that. for member in societies to advance thus advancing the society themselves there has to be constant critiquing and adjustments and growths. by the way, what part of celebrating about oppressed women and girls and the treating them that it is okay to be raped and beat up just because they are women. evil can not be celebrated. none of the other races think it is acceptable to change they way of life to accommodate for others not like them, so why should we Americans, Christians, or whites. we need to stop allowing ourselves to be bullied by other people who are trying to tell us that we are and have been doing the wrong things when we aren't, the new comers need to conform to the society they are entering, not the other way around.
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Interestingly I now have two comments in moderation. Does this mean if one does not share the same philosophy as the editor one shall be forever censored? I understand it's your site and you can do whatever you want but it would be nice if other points of view were at least considered even if the editors don't agree with them. Or have you guys taken the New York Times/Washington Post view that anything anyone ever needs to hear comes from you, no one else 's opinions welcome?
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I agree and I would like to know why the media is so biased, and also why they are so ignorant. I mean how can they be educated and use only a root word synonymously to mean the whole word, you can not keep interchanging terror to mean terrorism, terrorists, terrorize, terrorist you need to use an ending on the word or it is incorrect. And the media and George W are the ones who started this at the 9-11 terrorist attacks and they were so stupid they started calling it terror attacks, and that is incorrect. Why hasn't anybody ever corrected them in all these years.
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Something that a thinking person knows is that we have the most spent on military each year than all of the other countries in the world combined. We needed a war that is easy to keep going forever that is why we have a war on terrorism. Terrorism is whatever the people in office decide that it is. The media is money motivated, they will not show stories that are critical of those that pay the bills, and GE and many others are major military contractors.
Besides, fear and hate are what drive most major spending. You could say that these killers did what they did out of hate and fear that was programmed into them, and in the end the only ones that win are those that started the problems. There are no major world powers in this world that do not sell arms, or something else that eventually leads to the harm of many.
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you are wrong, when other nations like the muslims are spreading their evil though out the world even to people who had welcomed them, when they are acting irrationally and disrespectfully of others, then they are the wrong ones, and when they start murdering our own citizens we need to take action. the muslims are trying to take over the would, that is their agenda or are you not thinking enough of a person to figure that out. i do not want to ever have sheia law as a woman, it is very sexist and they are back in the seventh century as far as social advancements and when they try to impose that on the rest of the world they need to be taught to mind their own business.
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Glad to see a voice of reason here Paul. At the risk of realizing some of your beliefs are wrong, it's not difficult to escape the effects of propaganda (including the smokescreen of religion) and have an understanding of what's going on in the Middle East. This is particularly true thanks to internet access and search engines. Here are a couple of great queries to search. These will fill in the blanks about the ongoing Business of War that Paul correctly highlighted.
Who created ISIS? Arms exporters Arms importers
For those supporting the current wars, please do an "image" search for War in Iraq (or Syria, Libya, etc) They say a picture is worth a thousand words. Click some of the photos to enlarge them at take a long, hard look. Is this what you want? If it's not, stop supporting and encouraging it for starters. Stop believing the non-stop propaganda. Do something to promote peace and humanity. For you church members, ask what is my church doing to promote peace and harmony? Stand up in your congregation and ask them to join you in spreading peace, love and acceptance to all of God's creation.
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Obama created ISIS, he did that to try to topple Asaid. But he was stupid and not only should he had not been doing things like that, but he thought he could control them and he found out he couldn't.
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I am sick of hearing about "muslim religion". It is NOT a religion, it is a perversion against sanity. I give it the same consideration as I do satanism, the kkk, the blm movement, or any other perverse form of hate. It is time to see this "belief" for what it is, hate. I do not support allowing this hate into my community. I will NEVER support anything about it. If you find this offensive, talk with someone who has lost a loved one fighting for a people who HATE everyone.
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Sorry to hear about your loss. However, Satanists, Christians, and all others stand on the same side when it comes to the Muslim Faith. They are willing to kill all of those that are different than themselves if they have a slightly different practice when it comes to their idea of Islam.
When we do not look out for each other, it allows those among us that wish us harm more ability to do all of us harm; As in divide and concur.
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As far as the ,muslims are concerned, that might be so, but as far as we sane people are conserved it is as ultamatesmurfgod says, which to me still does not make the satanists or the muslims any different the the other, in fact i believe muslims are satanists regardless what they might say. I really don't care what they say, or think, i just assume like to see them all go to hell. In fact why are we so worried about what the evil people think, we are not alive to make them happy, we need to stop thinking that we need to coddle them. The more they are coddled the worse they will get. coddling makes people evil. They don't care about what the rest of the world wants so it doesn't matter what they want, it's them or use, and i don't plan for it to be me or mine.
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according to the Muslims they might but they don't according to my faith and since i don't acknowledge their faith as credible, in fact i think they are the pot calling the kettle black so i don't care what their faith says, i say they are evil and Satanic. old Muhammad was possessed by a demon and that is satanic.
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it sure is a religion, it is an evil satanic religion, and it needs to be addressed so that we can see when Satan is knocking on the door so we don't let them in. that is just the same kind of denial as the president who doesn't even want to address the problem as being a problem with the muslims fundamentally values structures. look it is like this, they will not accept the existence of anybody but other people who think like them,and it is do or die, and i don't plan on either. i will do something before i let them rule me. and this country or the world will not be worth the pot to piss in if we let them rule. that is why Jesus came to the world in the fist place to change and up lift the Israelite and other people of that day were living behind the times and did not want to advance and if they don't want to volunteerally change then we need to teach them that they have to in order for us to survive. it has nothing to do with us hating, the Muslims are the haters. we have to protect ourselves and our way or life.
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God created gay people to bring the evil out of others and I can see your evilness shinning through. Until you realize that almighty God created everything even the hateful things like you and Mr Hoagie you do not have the right to judge anyone. I will pray for you Sister and hope you two will see the light some day. The light of God's almighty love. That seem to escape most followers of a religion. The question that you need to answer is What God are you following? It sounds from your posts that you are tied to the Devil. Many are called but few are chosen. I forgive you so go and sin no more
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you are wrong, God knew what he was doing, and was not wrong about that, God did not create Homosexuals, he created the humans to be able to choose right or wrong, but he did not create them to be homosexuals, he created them to mate with the opposite sex that is why he created one of each sex not more then one of each and told them to live forever just being each others partners, he said to multiply and populate the earth, and you cant do that if you are a homosexual. that is what God intended, you are the one who is mixed up. We are not the evil ones we obey God and His rules so therefore we are not the ones who are the evil ones. The ones who are miss guided and not following Gods rules are the miss guided ones and you miss guided ones are the ones who needs prayers. Read your scriptures it is quite self explanatory in the scriptures. see Leviticus, and Romans and genesis, and even when Jesus was asked about this he quoted genesis, unless you also believe Jesus to be evil.
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it is very much a mental illness, as it the homosexual society. rather any of them want to accept and admit to it is another issue, but it does not change the facts that those view point are the view points of people who are mentally ill. Face it, people who are psychotic do not accept that they are, and so you do not actually believe that know they are mentally ill. of course they don't but we sane people are supposed to know better, we are the ones who are supposed to teach them that. and help them. not let sick people lead us, that is why this world is fucked up.
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A new record, mary/marysbirdworld!! As of today, you've posted exactly half of the comments (18/36) on this article by posting well into the wee hours on some of them.
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so, i don't care.
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Let's not make a point of saying that Islam is anti-gay as one of the directives of Christianity is that if two men lie together they should be stoned to death....Christianity is just as anti-gay as any other religion.....but then there are a number of Christian directives that call for the death of those who go against the instructions of the Christian God....funny that one of the main commandments is that we should not kill yet more people have been killed in the name of Christianity than can possibly be counted....even their God has been guilty of killing scores of people for not following his directives....what a hypocrite....I have absolute tolerance for Christians as I do for any other religion, but let's not paint them as some sort of saints for anything....
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Here's a link to the number of people God has killed (or were killed at his command), James. Unlike yourself, I have little tolerance for bigotry, hatred and self imposed ignorance for any reason, religious or otherwise.
http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.ca/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
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Forget the barbarity of the OT…. what did Jesus say about homosexuality? Can any Christians provide NT scripture clearly stating your Saviour's teachings about it under the new covenant?
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Christianity might be anti homosexual and for good reasons, but at least they dont kill them any longer. so them homos should stop being homos. no body but them and satan wants them to be homos. s then they should stop doing it if they dont like how they are being treated.
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Unfortunately it seems that all three players in the article made foolish decisions, leading to tragic results. Irregardless of the boys religion and the mans' sexual orientation, what I am gleaning from this article is that each of them probably had their own agenda. And now a man has been brutally murdered and 2 young men will most likely spend the rest of their lives being branded as murderers.
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In this context of sharing , Brothers and sisters, I would like to mention this: We must positioned our selves to give the abilities to help others or the community realize their. To do this you must realize your own intrinsic value(personal) and capacity to give without limit from the endless inner resource of Divine love. In this way you realize the interdependence you have with your surrounding community and realize the health of individual is dependent on the health of the community. Developing a compassionate identification with emotional needs of others and the community reveals that the real purpose to life is to help one another. In fulfilling that purpose you will find true and lasting satisfaction. Here you realize your true value in your ability to heal and encourage the highest in people and in situation. May God bless all of you.
Women and young girls are being raped in Sweden, England Etc.By immigrants that have been let into the countries.Black men and women are killed in this country due to color! Hate Breeds hate! Hatred and injustice is not of God! and has never been! No matter what color or ethnic background you are! nor your sexual preferences. in our lifetimes we all come across some form of hatred, injustice and stereotyping! That is why it is most important to stay in the Word! To stay prayed up! and have a close walk with God! The word tells us about the state of the World! and always has.
are you blind, there is a war of good and evil, it has not been won yet, we are supposed to be continuing to resist and fight against the urges to do evil things, so yes we are still at war with good and evil and God want us to protect ourselves from the evil. And when Jesus comes back and suppresses the evil and takes them off to be isolated until God destroys them, then you will see that he will not coddle them, coddling is evil and does not accomplish anything good, in fact coddling is what is making these animals the way they are. The evil will not end on its own. the evil will not stop until we are all enslaved and praying is not going to do any good, when i grew up, i was bullied, being passive did not stop it, the only thing that stopped it was fighting back, that gets respect. evil wants cowards to think the way you are thinking because they know they can keep stomping on you and you will get weaker and weaker until you start believing that you are powerless to get out of the situation on your own. voila, you just made yourself a slave, well some of us wont live like that.