Police in the Philippines

In just over a year, at least 3,100 drug dealers and users have died at the hands of police (and that’s a conservative estimate).


Drug dealers are not exactly model citizens, but do they deserve to die? In the Philippines, the answer is a resounding “yes”. Upon taking office, the country’s president, Rodrigo Duterte, instituted a uniquely violent strategy to combat the country’s drug problem: he told police to simply kill offenders on the spot. Authorities don’t just go after dealers, either – they target drug addicts as well. The government is banking on violent fear tactics to motivate people to lay down their pipes and needles.

When Duterte first announced the draconian policy last year, some didn’t take him seriously. But the Filipino strongman was dead serious, and the official crime numbers reflect that. In just over a year, at least 3,100 drug dealers and users have died at the hands of police (and that’s a conservative estimate). 96 have been killed in the past week alone. 

But that’s not all. He’s also encouraged regular citizens to go after dealers. “Do it yourself if you have a gun,” he tells his supporters.

Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte

President Duterte has embraced a “strongman” image. Despite his violent tactics, he remains tremendously popular.


A Popular President

President Duterte enjoys a “very good” approval rating of 67 percent according to a nonprofit survey conducted in June, indicating that a majority of Filipinos approve of the drastic measures being taken. Duterte himself has frequently praised the killings, insisting his country is moving in the right direction. Asked about a massive police raid that resulted in 32 deaths, he called the results “good”, and said that “if we can kill another 32 every day, then maybe we can reduce what ails this country.”

Duterte summed up his thoughts on the drug problem in a recent address to the nation:

“There is a jungle out there, there are beasts and vultures preying on the helpless, innocent and unsuspecting. I will not allow the ruin of the youth, the disintegration of families and the retrogression of communities caused by criminals whose greed for money is as insatiable as it is devoid of moral purpose.”He concluded with a forceful message to drug dealers: “You harm the children in whose the hands the future of this republic is entrusted and I will hound you to the very gates of hell.”
Catholics protesting in the Philippines

Philippine Catholics have protested against the killings, but the policy appears unlikely to change anytime soon.

Religious Disapproval

Not everyone is on board with the “shooting on sight” policy. Among those critical of Duterte’s tactics is Catholic Archbishop Socrates Villegas, who will begin a three-month-long protest by ringing his church bells for 15 minutes each night. “It’s not in our nature to be happy over the killings,” Villegas said. “Don’t we know how to weep?  Why aren’t we shocked by the gunfire and flow of blood on the sidewalk?”

He’s not alone. Many other Catholic leaders in the Philippines have decried the killings in their sermons, calling for an end to the violence. Although these religious voices reflect a growing resentment for the government’s bloody policies, the majority of the public remains in support.

Until public opinion shifts, the bodies will continue to pile up.

On the Home Front

“But is that such a bad thing?” supporters argue. For all its ugliness, they point out, the crackdown is producing positive results. More dead drug dealers means fewer deviants roaming the streets feeding users’ addictions and getting kids hooked. If you throw all moral concerns out the window, it’s hard to argue with that logic.

Is there any chance such a policy would catch on in the United States? After all, America is not without its own drug problems. The opioid epidemic is growing at a rapid pace, with over 60,000 deaths from drug overdoses last year. That’s double the amount from a decade before. What if it doubles again? Would we start to see calls for harsher measures?

Drug abuse destroys families, relationships, and lives. Some argue that the best way to get rid of drugs is to eliminate those who perpetuate the problem. It’s certainly not a gracious point of view, but one could understand how a family that has lost multiple loved ones to heroin might lack empathy for those who distribute it.

Drug Solutions

As long as the rule of law prevails, the U.S. won’t be enacting Duterte-like policies anytime soon. And thank goodness – the last thing we need right now is war in the streets. But detractors do make one good point: the opioid crisis isn’t going to solve itself. We’ll need to find solutions to reverse the growing epidemic, and soon. What can be done to combat America’s drug problem?

 

78 comments

  1. Los Guy says:

    Either civil rights are for everyone or eventually they are for no one…

    1. James says:

      Here in America, we built a country based on god given rights, wrote a social contract between the people and our govt. We agreed to limits of our rights and limited the gives power. That being said, our constitution is ours and only protects U. S. Citizens. Out side of that it is each countries business. Unfair, horrific, and other wise. Yes even sad. But problems settle themselves. One way or another.

      1. Los Guy says:

        Your post has nothing to do with what I said.Obviously the President of the Philippines is not interested in civil rights of his country. You are seeing the start of removing civil rights from the Philippine people…

        1. Alan says:

          Have you ever been to the Philippines? they have no human rights to start with, you Yanks made 3-4 families so powerful it’s a dictatorship posing as a democracy

          1. John Owens says:

            On what do you base the statement that the Yanks made those families so powerful? The Philippines were dominated by the Spanish long before the Spanish-American war.

      2. John Smithkey says:

        I agree with James. He stated that ” problems settle themselves”. Yes! Most problems will eventually resolve by themselves. The drug problem is has no easy solutions. The problem will eventually resolve by itself. John Smithkey III RN BSN

  2. Simon Peres says:

    How many innocent neighbors were killed in Philippines by corrupt uniformed police, because a neighbor police did not like them or because of other silly neighbor’s disputes.
    Even the same president, may send to kill his competitions, accusing them to be drug dealers, and this fact is well known in such countries.
    Killing, could be execute, when judges and lawyers have done their obligations.
    I am personally, against the death penalty and leave the decision to our CREATOR, the only, who may give and take lives.

  3. John Owens says:

    The Philippines can be a beautiful place, but like any other, has its unique problems. I dislike the idea of having to resort to citizen militia or vigilantism to protect homes and families, because of the opportunity to commit murder for personal reasons, and blame it on the other’s criminal activities.

    However, if a person KNOWS that dealing will get them killed without any penalty for the killer, and deals anyway, it could easily be considered like suicide by cop, or you might just say they are asking for it.

    I know people have been dumbed down so much, that they will often use addictive drugs for diversion (I am not criticizing people who are forced to use them, or accidentally addicted by pain-killers because of severe chronic pain), telling themselves they will not become a junkie, because they think they are smarter than EVERYONE ELSE who uses the same drug. They just don’t realize, the drug doesn’t care how smart or stupid you are–it’s a chemical, and has a similar effect on anyone who uses it that does not exercise control over the drug and themselves.

    Drug abuse is a MAJOR contributor to all manner of crime in many countries, and I suppose life has become very cheap in the Philippines due, in part to the drug abuse. President Duterte knows his people and their problems better than we do, and since we have no say in this (rather than voicing opinions), I guess we’ll just have to wait see if this policy bears good fruit or evil. I hope since they have resorted to this drastic measure, that the drug-dealing will quickly end, and that a less lethal approach to law and order can and will be enacted. I would love to see the Philippines enjoying peace and prosperity for a change.

    1. Pastor B Stevens says:

      Your pretty ignorant aren’t you — he drinks alcohol every day a life ending family destroying drug . He is using this ideal to dope ignorant uneducated population into this ideal . As of one over half of the murders are directly tied to his personal political oponuts . Get it dummy ? Yes drugs are killing family’s so let’s start with the alcohol industry to the high government thugs get from wasting billions $$$ for personal gains . Sure drugs destroy family’s always have for many thousands of years . Stop greed in government share wealth evenly with everyone the need for drugs evaporates . It’s a known fact when people have what’s needed for every day living with out stressing out over over tax over billed endless debt they don’t turn to drugs to escape this fact . In our own country the majority of heroine addicts are in city’s where there are No Jobs no hope they turn to drugs to escape reality . This leads to drug dealers distributing chemicals that help lost souls escape being beat down by their own government greed . This is what’s going on world wide the 1% of wealthy pigs crushing everyone else with high prices of every day living leaving every one in debt . The president of the philepone people is also robbing their country’s bank accounts . He wants to be king just like Donald Trump 🤔
      Wake up your delusional and your just what the government wants ignorant population never questioning facts. In the USA right now every time trump gets caught in serious lies what does he scream Fake News !

      1. John Owens says:

        On the contrary, I am not pretty ignorant. I happen to think you are a jerk who just hates Trump for the Hell of it, but no, I’m not ignorant. You might be, but I wouldn’t know, because all I have to go by is this little hissy-fit you typed here. Sounds like you think you know soooo much. Let me ask you this– if you know so much, from whence came that knowledge, and what are you doing with it? Besides hating on Trump, I mean. Because that’s all I’m hearing from you, is that you hate Trump, and that is not EVEN a part of this issue, but you had to throw it in, maybe due to some little paranoid obsession or something. But, NO. I am not as ignorant as you seem to be, judging by this little anti-Trump tirade. You don’t live with your parents, do you?

        1. Pastor B Stevens says:

          You took on this short read as if someone was implying this comment is only concerning you . I speak from a life within federal government work for which I retired from . If your offended by any of this please look in the mirror . Anyone whom would reply such as you have certainly is easily warped to make any statement about You . self centered persons make everything about them self . Think before you post such statements 😎

          1. John Owens says:

            You were replying to ME, B., as you went on your nonsensical anti-Trump rant, which really, really, really has NOTHING to do with the Philippines or Duterte. I was a little surprised you didn’t throw in some global warming there, somewhere, and some socialism and something about Russia. Still, you can’t turn this back on ME and say I am “easily warped” when you are ALREADY warped, and then call me “self-centered” when I didn’t make ANYTHING about me except for your asinine rant. YOU need to think before YOU post such statements, I thought quite a bit before I posted MY statement preceding yours, which WAS a reply to ME. I didn’t attack anyone. “The thorn stands ready to defend the rose, yet it is at peace, and seeks not challenge.”

          2. Pastor B Stevens says:

            Again this has nothing to do with you , your going off about Trump so apparently your offended with facts . Again being redundant you made this about you . I’ll comment on any leader I don’t care what party they represent at that moment . If your upset let it go this has 0 to do with you . The ones it concerns will not comment they know what I’m putting out there .

          3. JOHN MAHER says:

            YOU HAVE NOW READ from JOHN BOOGER the tRUMPIE OWINS from the VILLAGE VILLAGE of tRUMPIE IDIOTS, BIG MOUTH, LONG E N D L E S S POSTs, NO FACTs AS USUAL, AS tRUMP, CALLS EVERYONE to INSULT like HIS BUTTIE tRUMP, WHITE MAN SPEAKS with FORKED TONGUE !!! DUMP the IGNORAMUS COWARDLY CRIMINAL TRAITOR tRUMP and ALL HIS tRUMPIES, GOD is GREAT,so is the US of A………..P.S. PASTOR B STEVENS, tRUMPIES CANNOT SEE THEMSELVES in the MIRROR, to HIDEOUS……………….

          4. John Owens says:

            Now you’re just being a squirrel, but that’s okay. Facts don’t bother me, either. What bothers me is how left-leaning people think it is okay to lie like Hell all the time, and just doing it makes the lie true. You DID reply to me. If you cannot look at the screen and figure that out, you are too warped for me to argue with you. I didn’t pull that out of my backside– this blog is fixed so you can POST COMMENT or POST REPLY to others. That’s what you did IN THE BEGINNING, you posted a reply to my comment and you started it with an insult. What kind of response did you think you should get?

            By the way Maher, I’m glad you are okay. I was beginning to worry about you since you weren’t stalking me for a few days. You’re an irritating crap-for-brains, but I really am glad you are okay. These blogs would not exist if we all thought the same, because they would be waaayy too boring.

        2. JOHN MAHER says:

          JOHN the BOOGER tRUMPIE OWINS, I BELIEVE the PASTOR MEANT * PETTY IGNORANT * U DO NOT SEE YOURSELF in the MIRROR so U DO NOT KNOW HOW NOT PRETTY BUTT HIDEOUS U R, DUMP the IGNORAMUS COWARDLY CRIMINAL TRAITOR tRUMP and ALL HIS VILLAGE IDIOT tRUMPIES, GOD is GREAT so is the US of A

    2. guardians says:

      appreciate your comments-we as Filipino knows what is right and what is not good. the campaign of the administration against drug favored by 80% of Filipino.

      To non Filipino critics, mine your backyard first before try to clean the others yard.

      1. John Owens says:

        Galing Mo.

  4. James says:

    The United States constitution gives the majority the right to change govt. Vote then out, or remove them by court proceedings.

  5. Paul Hoogeveen says:

    The rule of law in the United States requires due process.

    Without due process, the rule of law is debased.

    When the rule of law is debased, innocents — usually the most disenfranchised within a society — bear the cost.

    Replacing one evil with another is not a solution.

    1. angel722 says:

      This article isn’t written about the US. This country can do as it wishes!

  6. Pastor B Stevens says:

    As we now we’ll know in America the Crack epidemic was created by the CIA bringing in the cocaine sold to big dealers distributed on our streets especially poor areas . This was done to raise funds for colvert operations it’s now a known fact . After the US got hold of Afgan us war who took over the opium fields ? That’s right the CIA , now we have ummm opioids are a wide sweep let’s be on point Opium heroine period . Where does heroine come from —- that’s right again the very opium fields the CIA controll . They recently threw in prescription pills to,cover their asses . Our current heroine problem is squarely caused by our own government . Our government needs lots of money to continue to have endless war in the Middle East . Mostly a religious war began centuries ago still perpetrated today by our current religious freaks in office . Opium will continue to be shipped to the USA it funds our CIA and non military contractors . And what did trump just announce ? Yea more war and where — Afgan regions ripe with opium 🤔 1960s LSD was allllll over the place who put LSD on the streets — FBI & CIA , wake up stupid your being brain washed by the very ones in power that are the biggest drug distributors in our country . Look to Bill Clinton and the Menia AR connection selling both cocaine and marijuana to fund the contras . Duhhhhhh god our population is so dam easily lead around to their own demise by the most evil SOAB#%*es in our own country . Our federal gov is BROKE $$$$$$ last spring while you slept at 1:30 am eastern time your lovely Republican Party stole 50 Billion from SSI to fund our military and they claim its government money as they still attempt to kill SSI because our government has stripped the accounts to keep certain people very very wealthy . The Republican Party as well as Democratic Party has played all of us for fools .
    As for murdering drug dealers that would lead to executions of anyone the government wishes to eliminate . Just thrown in a few pounds of elicit dangerous drugs set up by the same Presto legal murder . Now what about the #1 most dangerous drug in America —- Alcahol is a Drug period as we here these pukes pounding their DEA chest in the other hand they are consuming alcohol . There is no doubt drugs kill lots of people so do automobile accidents hundreds of thousands die each year in accidents so why are we still allowed to drive and especially texting . Because it’s padding the money train —–. 🤔 How many years did each state in America Knew tobacco was killing millions ? A hell of a long time why did it continue — taxes were filling their pockets . So later on states decided to sue tobacco companies for billions all together only because the health cost passed the profits thus tobacco no longer was profitable . I personally was addicted to nicotean as a baby in 1963 parents somked allll around children and babies . Breathing in the smoke children were addicts without actually smoking it was contact through air and skin . At the age of 14 I was smoking every day no one cared . My own mother smoked while pregnant nicotine coursing through my blood before birth . What’s taking place with these drug executions we know for a fact over half murdered are enemies of the president . Our own president Donald Trump thanked the SOAB for killing drug dealers wished by his own words we would do the same here in America . I wonder when the population will rise up and wipe out thev1% in power in America that’s killing all of us ? Right now Trump is using Hitler’s play book to rip our country in half on purpose . Conflict like this will lead to another civil war within our own borders . Trump wants to build a wall not to,stop drugs they are flown in on drones and small craft now . He wants a closed society just like North Korea he loves their laws he said so back st the beginning of taking office then puffs up his chest concerning missle test by North Korea . Its alllll a show to build hatred within our borders . If they want to stop drugs in America they must destroy all alcohol distributirs alcohol is the entrance to other drugs . It’s not going to happen because the ones playing the game consume the same . All this crap leads to nothing but more war which leads to profits for big wealthy corporations . Everyone has been brain washed into soooo many lies . There are far more deaths in America caused by other devices and vices . Why is it sooooo important any gov wants to stop drugs when they themselves consume them ? Every warm living body is a slave they count on your hard work to tax you to death for income of government waste .
    I get so dam mad hearing Jeff Sesions state all he’s going to do to pot smokers one drug that has been found to cure a lot of sicknesses . He’s nothing but another tool in the box for the CIA . At the same time states he’s a Christian ! He’s no more a Christian than a dam wasp , pin any of these sorry bastards claiming that point out they are Not following the teachings of Justus they get really pisedd off — why? Because as normal these claiming they are Christian’s while doing the opposite are using a belief system for nothing but a excuse to get the ignorant population to agree with their evil acts . Humans have used drugs as long as our hands have been able to grab things to pull it to mouth which is millions of years . Drugs are a povitol part of today’s profits from caffeine to sugar to MSG then climb higher and higher to greater more potent drugs . So in conclusion the SOAB president murdering drug dealers and users needs to shoot himself in the head because he himself is addicted to drugs be it hard drugs or caffeine , sugar, fats, alcohol so on and on . This president is using the ignorant to buy into a ideal he him self uses to murder his oponuts mixed with some actual drug dealers . Keep in mind your current president loves this man which begs the question what is Donald Trump really about 🤔

    1. JOHN MAHER says:

      PASTOR B STEVENS, AT LAST SOME ONE WITH FACTs, REAL FACTs and THANK YOU SIMON PERES, BRAVO

  7. Simon Peres says:

    I used to live, as professional in many many countries in the world and realized that nearly 60% of the police, authorities and even the presidents with his congress, are guilty of the drug problem, because most of them are alcohol and drug abusers.
    In order to to solve a great part of this problems, we have to start eliminating the police and the authorities…we need honest and human presidents, who really love humanity and have a good faith.
    Some people have the power to print money legally, but other have to sell drugs as competition to survive, and start with money laundering.
    As one of the examples, is the president of Philippines, who gives orders to corrupt police to execute drug dealers , at the spot.
    This means, that we don’t need judges and lawyers.
    This man suppose to be criminal and drug abuser, corrupt and even dictator.
    As long as, few people, print money legally, without having any support of gold and without other reserves, this problem of DRUGS, will not be solved.
    God bless all objective THINKERS

  8. gerrydiamond says:

    In United Kingdom we do not have the death penalty and generally our police are not armed with guns. So dealing with drug dealing is contentious issue and an insidious evil that wrecks families and communities. It should be treated as a health and social care issue rather than having a shoot to kill policy which does not allow the due process of the law to be subverted by a licence to kill suspected dealers and addicts.

  9. Michael Clark says:

    Let’s take religion and public opinion by survey out the equation and look at history. This was done in South America just to make way for others under disguise. Check several Asian countries the same. It’s also a repeat for his country.

    Unless He shoots the money men he is wasting time and lives

    True the violence by the street thugs and gangs are 200% worst than American cities mainly because of corruption in the government (from word of mouth, documentaries and articles. They must suffer from amnesia like America

  10. John Owens says:

    You replied to ME, B, and you make stupid assumptions and an anti-Trump tirade, which has NOTHING whatsoever to do with this, and then make out like I AM THE IRRATIONAL one? Too late, Pal. You showed your colors. Just because you were a professional bureaucrat doesn’t make you an expert on anything except how to do whatever inefficiently. YOU NEED TO THINK before you type your ANTIFA-sounding crap.

    1. JOHN MAHER says:

      ZZZZZZZZTT, WRONG AGAIN BOOGER OWINS, READ the PAPER,LISTEN to FACTUAL NEWs, STOP TRYING to SEE UR SELF in the MIRROR, DO NOT GO THERE ! YOUR GREAT AGAIN PRESIDENT tRUMP is an EXTENSION of UR INTELLECT, NOWHERE, NOTHING, BEEN THERE, WHERE ??? H E L L O !!! I AWARD U BOOGER with the OFFICIAL VILLAGE of tRUMP IDIOT TROPHY, the FIST, USE it WELL tRUMPIE

  11. rabbi jim says:

    Yes, by all means, blow all the dealers off the face of the earth along with all of the terrorists. Burn all of the illicit drug crops in the world. And while we are at it, confiscate all of the hand guns in the world and melt them down. Make cigarette lighters with the resulting metal. Shalom, and have a wonderful fruitful blessed day all!

  12. Debbie Anderson says:

    Only barbarians support the death penalty.

    1. John Owens says:

      Just curious. On what authority do you base that opinion?

    2. Los Guy says:

      John Owens I would suspect that she got it from the Bible, you know “Thou shalt not kill”…

      1. John Owens says:

        But even then, they had death penalty for certain crimes, (including rape) in order to show the actual value of human life. In fact, that commandment should have been translated, “Thou shalt not commit murder.” That would mean we could not defend ourselves if attacked, if we take it just as it is translated. We could not even eat, if we take that mistranslation literally, because even many vegetables must be killed to be eaten. What is a major contradiction to me, is that many people who do not believe in the death penalty, believe civilians should not have firearms, and DO believe in free and easy abortion on demand. I should think it would be obvious that when DEALING WITH BARBARIANS, one MUST deal with them ON THEIR LEVEL, or the civilized people will end up in stew-pots being eaten for dinner. For instance, how do you deal with a suicide bomber coming at you? If you can’t kill them, many people are dead.

        1. Los Guy says:

          So are you the one that needs to translate the Bible for us…?

          1. John Owens says:

            I’m sorry if common sense seems like a know-it-all to you, but you cannot read one line and make a whole doctrine or philosophy out of it. I know the context of the Ten Commandments very well. I can quote Exodus 20 KJV word for word in its entirety. I’m just saying, if “Thou shalt not kill ” means not under any circumstance, we would all starve. You couldn’t eat fish or potatoes or meat or radishes, most grains, a lot of things.

            I think it is barbaric not to punish criminals in some measure commensurate or reciprocal to their crimes. I only wanted to know her authority for her statement. It is not biblical, so what is it?

          2. Los Guy says:

            John Owens, it is not for you to tell anyone what the Bible is supposed to say that is for their own interpretation and not your. Secondly so far the death penalty has not stopped any murders, rapes, kidnappings, etc. So far prison has not stopped crime. The source of criminal activity needs to be addressed more than the punishment.
            So it seems that you are only interested in revenge for a criminal event as a solution rather than striving to stop these types of crimes before they are committed. This is the problem with society revenge rather than a solution, this is the Christian way…

          3. John Owens says:

            You’re delusional. The death penalty is 100% effective in preventing the same murderer from committing any other murders. Don’t be an imbecile. You are spoiling for an argument, I’ll chew you up and spit you out and whizz on you. I didn’t interpret anything biblical. I TOLD YOU WHAT IT SAYS. If you don’t KNOW what it says, you don’t know enough to be TALKING to me. If JUSTICE IS NOT RECIPROCAL, IT IS NOT JUST. How stupid do you have to be to argue with that?

          4. Los Guy says:

            Like I said you are into revenge killing and your statements proves it. Yes, you kill one murder he won’t murder again but it does not stop people from murdering. Prison is not meant to reform it is just a revenge punishment system. The system does not help to prevent crime it just make smarter criminals by putting them together so they can share how to commit better crimes. We need to find a way to fix the problem of crime because revenge does not work and has not worked in preventing crime for the last 10,000 years.
            No you told me what the verse was supposed to mean, it is your interpretation of the commandment, you need to use logic instead of emotion for your answers.
            You will never be able to chew me up and spit me out because you do not have the intellect to perform that…

          5. John Owens says:

            I ALREADY DID. You admitted as much. You are missing a chromosome. Please go back to your video games like a good little geek.

          6. Los Guy says:

            Yes you did, you proved you believe in revenge killing for a criminal and you seem to think that you are the interpreter of the Bible for the world. You are such a silly little boy…

          7. John Owens says:

            I’m a little sorry for being sarcastic with you, because it won’t help you learn. Let me simplify it for you– If I break your 2017 Toshiba laptop that costs $650 tax and all, and I give you a 2012 $300.00 Dell for it, is that justice?
            If I steal $100 from you, how much do I owe you? It has to be AT LEAST $100, doesn’t it?
            Let’s say you have an accidental death and dismemberment insurance policy and it pays $10,000 for the loss of a hand, and you lose your hand. Is it legal or proper for the Insurer to only pay you $2000?
            Put it another way– If you want to sell an old Toyota with 300,000 miles on it for $500, and I give you $100, but the bill of sale says $500, is that a legal sale? Or do I need to cough up the $500?
            It HAS TO BE RECIPROCAL. To have a contract, “FAIR AND EQUAL CONSIDERATION MUST BE EXCHANGED.” That is how JUSTICE works, and anything else is NOT JUSTICE, and that should be perfectly obvious to all but the most fervent “social justice warriors.”
            I don’t believe in prisons. There is no provision for prisons in all the Torah, because it gave a system of justice such that prisons were not required. You brought up the Torah, when you mentioned the Commandment. Then our conversation just went off the rails.

          8. Los Guy says:

            Crime is a social disease created by mans greed, You want an eye for an eye revenge and I want a cure for the social disease that has been created by religions which create an us and them mentality. The criminal, the poor, the illiterate, the young, the elderly, and everyone else are all part of the same family but by separating us into the theist and atheist, the good and bad, the right and left, etc you reinforce the duality that is splitting the world today. When it become so necessary for one side to conquer the other because of some ideal that must be permeated through out all of mankind is one of the great evil lies of religion and politics.
            Justice is a man made construct that is common to an extended social group like a family, tribe, city, state or country and is not arbitrary to that social group but based on experience over time and usually a consensus of the social group; so your view of justice is based on your experiences and social indoctrination and not on a resolution to the problem but revenge for committing the act as well as getting back as much or more than the loss; GREED…

          9. John Owens says:

            This is relevant to the conversation:

            David Rediger

            February 1, 2017 at 1:03 pm

            I am surprised that you have misinterpreted the Commandments in such a way. Jewish law views the shedding of innocent blood very seriously, and lists murder as one of three sins (along with idolatry and sexual immorality) that fall under the category of yehareg ve’al ya’avor, meaning “One should let himself be killed rather than violate it.” Jewish law enumerates 613 Mitzvot, or commandments, including prohibition of murder and a number of other commandments related to the preserving of human life and administration of justice in cases of shedding of innocent blood.

            A number of sins were considered to be worthy of the death penalty including murder, incest, bearing false witness on a capital charge, adultery, idolatry, having sexual relations with a member of the same sex, etc.

            It is forbidden to murder, as it says “You shall not murder” (Exodus 20:13, Deuteronomy 5:17).
            A murderer must be put to death, as it says “He shall be avenged” (Exodus 21:20, see Leviticus 24:17,21); it is forbidden to accept compensation from him instead, as it says “You shall not take redemption for the life of a murderer…; and there shall be no atonement for the blood that was spilled… except the blood of him that spilled it” (Numbers 35:31-33). It is forbidden to execute a murderer before he has stood trial, as it says “And the murderer shall not die until he stands before the congregation for judgment” (Numbers 35:12). However, we are commanded to prevent an attempted murder by killing the would-be murderer if necessary, and it is forbidden to refrain from doing so, as it says “And you shall cut off her hand; you shall not be merciful” (Deuteronomy 25:12); and similarly for attempted fornication, as it says “[If the man seizes her and lies with her…] just as a man rises up against his friend and murders him, so is this thing”(Deuteronomy 22:26). It is forbidden to refrain from saving life when it is in one’s power to do so, as it says “You shall not stand on your friend’s blood”(Leviticus 19:16).
            — Rabbi Dr. Azriel Rosenfeld

            As described in the Torah, the ancient understanding of the prohibition of murder made an exception for legitimate self-defense. A home defender who struck and killed a thief caught in the act of breaking in at night was not guilty of bloodshed. “If a thief is caught breaking in and is struck so that he dies, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed; but if it happens after sunrise, he is guilty of bloodshed.”[31]
            A man’s house is his castle, and God’s law, as well as man’s, sets a guard upon it; he that assaults it does so at his peril.
            — Matthew Henry’s Commentary on Exodus 22

            Read more at https://www.themonastery.org/blog/2017/01/would-jesus-want-gun-control/#ewJdqBglPdpkmxQ3.99

            I would like to cure people from crime, also, Guy. That has to be done at a very early age, because, as everyone knows, our characters are made when we are very young. If we are not taught definite right and wrong from a very early age, we will most likely never learn it, certainly not in most cases after the age of 15 or so. What we end up doing is trying to modify behavior using a carrot and stick approach– do good and you get a carrot, do bad and you get a whack with a stick. For the most part, society has proven that coddling and counseling only make the coddlers and counselors feel good, but seldom do more to help the criminal than help them get out so they can commit more crime. That is reality. I’m sorry about that.

          10. John Owens says:

            Oh, and BTW, greed is not created by religion. Religion attempts to address it, but usually only succeeds in thinly disguising it. The us and them mentality exists where the only religion is the Collective. It exists among all nationalities, tribes, religions, different forms of government. Animals do not know any religion, yet it exists in animals. Humans are part animal. It cannot be exorcised from humanity, as long as humans are in their present form. In the Kingdom of God, the character of humans will be changed, but until then nothing is going to change human nature.

          11. Los Guy says:

            John Owens religion is the major cause of greed by creating a division between believers and non-believers, followers of older religions,etc you create the basic foundation for greed…

          12. John Owens says:

            You are full of crap, but let’s just play your game for a minute. If religion is the major CAUSE of greed, WHY DOES GREED EXIST IN THE ABSENCE OF RELIGION?

          13. Los Guy says:

            John Owens I know you will not understand this but when you have an US and Them mentality greed is created…

          14. John Owens says:

            and YOU will not understand, because you have swallowed one line of thought and closed your mind to any other, that the GREED comes first. Little babies who cannot talk and have no frame of reference experience GREED and jealousy. Religion has nothing to do with that.

          15. Los Guy says:

            John Owens You cannot relate a babies actions to that of adults that is like comparing apples to oranges but then again you are so involved with Ignorance that it is impossible for you to understand anything anyone else says unless it is complete agreement with you. The mind is a terrible thing to loose, where did you loose yours…

          16. John Owens says:

            I am telling you that religions do not create greed. Greed is inherent in physical creatures, including humans. It goes with having a body that must be sustained. You continue to insist they do, even though the preponderance of evidence shows otherwise. You will not understand, because it does not fit your narrow view of things.

          17. John Owens says:

            You should not accuse me of ignorance, when I am trying to teach you something you are unwilling or unable to learn. You should accuse me of patience with the less learned. I really am trying to be kind to you, but you would rather insult me so you can then pretend to be offended when I strike back. That shows weakness and doubt.

          18. Los Guy says:

            You are not teaching me anything about your ideology it is too full of holes and hate…

          19. John Owens says:

            Not one word of hate, Guy, and no holes. You said comparing babies to adults is like comparing apples to oranges– Not at all. It is comparing baby apples to ripened apples. THEY’RE ALL APPLES. You saying my writings are full of hate, is an obvious sign of lack of anything more intelligent to say on your part, meaning you must be mentally deficient. You cannot carry on an intelligent conversation. I am sorry for you.

          20. John Owens says:

            You have nothing more intelligent to say other than read some other person’s stuff? Is that what passes for logic and knowledge to you? Repeating someone else’s stuff? Geez. If you could show me where I was talking hate, as you accused me of doing, I wouldn’t be impressed, but maybe humbled a tiny bit. If you could actually tell me how religion creates greed where there is an absence of religion, I would REALLY be impressed. Did you know ATHEISTS are greedy? I don’t mean more greedy than anyone else. I’m just saying they, too, suffer that avarice. Even in communist countries. Did you know Hugo Chavez was greedy? Fidel Castro? Chairman Mao? It goes on and on. It is not really important to me, but it is obviously an incorrect philosophy you are espousing.

          21. John Owens says:

            If there is a book offered for ADULTS to learn about logic and deductive reasoning, perhaps you should read it, although if you didn’t learn it at an early age, chances are, you are already waaaay too far gone for it to help. Making references to ANYONE else’s writings does not excuse you accusing me of hate OR of being illogical. It only means you cannot think for yourself so you think it looks smart to quote someone, because you think they are an authority. You must know, being guided by authorities is only useful if you can look at their opinions and statements, and see how they may or may not apply to you or people you know. That would fall under assimilation, I guess. Then, deductive reasoning teaches you how to adapt that knowledge to different circumstances.

            They don’t teach that stuff in school much any more, Guy, because if people think for themselves, they might have different ideas than what their socialist/anarchist professors want them to think. Then it will be hard to tell them when to protest and what to protest and for whom to vote.

            Here is a logic question for you: Which is more likely to be truly ignorant?
            A) Someone who just graduated college at the age of 23 with a PhD in Philosophy, or
            B) Someone who had a High School Diploma and is a voracious reader who enlisted in the Military or went to work for the Police or a Fire Department and worked there for 35 years and raised a family and was a good citizen, or
            C) The two are equally likely to be ignorant, or
            D) There is not enough information to compute.

          22. Los Guy says:

            I am sorry that you have no memory left because I described it to you…

          23. Los Guy says:

            It is obvious that you do not read my post you just sit around trying to make out your not as ignorant and illiterate as you seem to be. I posted a good book on logic. Oh by the way I have had classes in logic and got my job at Microsoft by demonstrating good logic skills. You do not have the mentality to understand what I posted originally so it is obvious to me that posting to you is like posting to a wall. I have problems trying to have a discussion with people that do not even have a high school education and by your lack of understanding what I posted makes it quite clear and obvious you don’t seem to have one. So I will leave you to your mindless activities so you can post stupidity thinking that it make you smart. But just like Dictator Donald T Rump you do not have the where with all to understand good logic. So you go and post about how smart you are by making stupid statements I will will go my way. Bye now…

          24. John Owens says:

            You are a hilarious moron. An educated idiot. If you had a PhD., a Jew would call you a Phudnik (that’s a nudnik with a PhD.) If you actually had any skill with logic, YOU WOULDN’T HAVE TO STUDY BOOKS ON LOGIC, YOU WORM-BRAIN.

        2. angel722 says:

          I don’t see it as revenge killing, I see it as self defense! Obviously Los Guy never had his 5 year old son shot and killed in his own backyard because the drug dealer was to stupid to shoot the right person! People do what they gotta do. I don’t see how an intentional murder is justified, but self preservation is not!

          1. John Owens says:

            I agree, angel, but some people have had their heads filled with lofty ideas that are like white puffy clouds– when you look down at them from an airplane window, they look like they have substance, but if you fall, you fall right through them, because they have no real substance. They think it is humanism, but it is just more false religion, disguised as compassionate humanism.

            It is because of these faery tales about human nature and psychology and victimhood that there IS so much crime and murder, and the best ideas they can come up with is take guns away from decent law-abiding people, abort babies, legalize and normalize everything, give poor people any thing they want, open the borders and let the illegals vote, and delude ourselves that everything is going to be wonderful when we go totally socialist/communist/atheist.

          2. Los Guy says:

            Angel1722, I never mentioned self defense as revenge killing, it would help if you read my posts for content instead of looking foolish…

          3. Los Guy says:

            Yes John Owens some people are so stupid they read into a post things that are not there, like I said self defense is a revenge killing. You can make up a lot of shit but don’t try and make up stuff that you want me to have said so you can feel you are winning an argument when you are neither winning or losing just making up FAKE NEWS…

  13. eric k says:

    For those of you who never traveled or lived in some other parts of the world you are clueless, Here is an example in Rio de Janeiro Brasil 100 police officers have been killed year to date. And if you think its any different in parts of the Philippines your wrong > We live in the USA and unless you live in the hood you don’t know shit about drug dealers.

    Close all these pill mills down and either kill these people or put them in a very deep hole to rot, execute all the drug dealers and that will fix the problem , They have the right idea in the Philippines

    1. John Owens says:

      I’m afraid most of these people live either in gated communities, “rest homes,” or with their parents, and know diddly about the real world.

    2. caliwebman says:

      Wow, you are completely detached from reality there Eric K. DO you realize that the entire drug war was a farce, also that the massive budget (26 billion in 2015) for the war on drugs is actually funding much of what you have absolutely no clue about…. and I’ll tell you, it aint being spent on fighting any wear on drugs. Hey, they call radio and television, “programming” for a reason dude! Because these tools are used to program YOU! And my oh my, by your very statements here you are perfect example of a successful programming system! You want a solution? The solution to the drug problem is to legalize and regulate them all. Period. There are current and presidents of many country’s involved with this that include past UN Secretary’s, as well as a shitload of people who have half a brain. Come join us and WTF up! – http://www.drugpolicy.org/

      1. angel722 says:

        Your a pot smoker, aren’t you?

      2. angel722 says:

        So your suggesting that instead of buying it from the local dealer down the street, junkies buy it from the pharmacy? ” ”
        Yeah, I need a dime bag of crack, please!”
        ” I’m sorry, but we can’t fill that for you for another 3 days.”
        We can’t even control our pills, you think we can control cocaine?
        And don’t forget the manufacturing of it! Surgeon general warning say’s that this package may contain bleach, sianide, tylenol, spick and span,raid, rubbing alcohol, and many varieties of common household chemicals that may cause brain damage, overdoses, or mind altering behaviors that include drug induced psychosis.

        It’s easier and cheaper to just shoot them!

  14. angel722 says:

    Desperate times require drastic measures. Though I can be a humanitarian, I view drug dealer’s no different then terrorists. They kill and destroy innocent people both directly and indirectly. In this place, it’s out of control and you do what you gotta do!

    1. John Owens says:

      Yeah, for these people who are always harping about slavery, it seems they would see the slavery caused by drugs.

      1. Los Guy says:

        It is not slavery it is a mental disorder, read the studies on it…

        1. John Owens says:

          Guy, dealers use drugs to enslave people regularly. They keep them for a few days and get them addicted, and then those people have to work for them to get their fix. READ THE STUDIES ON IT.

          1. Los Guy says:

            John Owens I know you will not understand this but an addict is an addict because of a mental disorder. Secondly, drug dealers in third world countries deal because it is the only job available. No one grows up with the dream of becoming a drug lord…

          2. John Owens says:

            I’m talking about ANY country, Guy. Drugs are used to create slaves. Take your head out of its hiding place. Just because I think you are totally misguided does not mean I DON’T UNDERSTAND. Addiction is not just a mental disorder, either. The BODY becomes addicted to certain substances through exposure. That is physical, chemical. If exposed, one can become addicted regardless of prior mental health.

    2. Los Guy says:

      If you are destitute in a third world country and selling drugs will feed your family what choice do you really have…

  15. Bill Fox says:

    Germans kept voting for Hitler for the exact same thing this man is doing. The average citizen in the Philippines is outraged that this problem has gone on for three decades. Talking and pampering addicts had not worked.

  16. Dr. JayTea says:

    Humans have always sought to alter their consciousness. This is true in every culture and has been so for millennia. Just as morality cannot be legislated, human nature cannot be altered by mandate. We educators learn very quickly that students learn based upon their readiness to learn. Don’t believe it? Try teaching some preschoolers cosmology! In the same vein, look at recidivism and relapse rates for those sentenced to “corrective incarceration” or behavioral rehabilitation – they are not good. Forcing people to do right and avoid evil simply doesn’t work.
    Drug abuse (like child abuse, sex abuse, and all other forms of extreme behaviors) has complex, often irrational root-causes. Here in the U.S.A. the government has lost TRILLIONS of dollars and COUNTLESS lives – perpetrators, law enforcers, and innocents – in what can only be described as a long, protracted, and failed war on drugs. And it can be argued that our capitalist economy feeds addictions of all kinds as offerings to Mammon….
    We know that supply and demand comprise most transactions. Attacking the supply side of the drug issue hasn’t worked nor can it work.
    Maybe it’s time to try another tactic.
    Legalize drugs. The effect could not possibly be worse than the “war on drugs”.

  17. Chaplain Bill says:

    There is already a war in our streets and I hate to tell you we are losing. Drugs have become a multi billion dollar business and millions of lives, around the world, are being lost every day to these purveyors of death. Sadly these thugs hide behind US laws meant to protect innocent people. If I were king of the world the person caught selling drugs would be given a death sentence unless they rolled over on the people above them in the despicable chain. If that person is proven guilty they would face the death penalty. BTW there is no way you can have a billion dollar business and not have complicity of major banks. Any bank handling drug money should be just a guilty as the drug sellers.

    If you want to feel bad about someone don’t waste your time on these thugs. Feel bad for the store owner that gets robbed to feed a drug habit, the young girl that sells herself to pay for drugs that someone hooked her or neighborhoods living in terror because of the cartels. Death is actually to good for these merchants of death.

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